View Full Version : fin-kwik (the Original)
rgornik
10-01-2007, 08:32 PM
Our father was Mitch Gornik, the inventor of the origiinal metal Fin-Kwik. He was a tool and die maker who came up with the idea in response to my brother Mark's complaints about how hard it was to put fins on accurately. He made the original dies and had them stamped at a buddy's shop; my brothers and I did the threading and final packaging. Dad was proud of his invention and it was a real kick in the pants when Estes stopped buying from him and went to their plastic version. Anyway, I have about 20 FIN-KWIKS in their original packaging. If there is any interest please let me know. Happy rocketing. rgornik
Chas Russell
10-01-2007, 09:32 PM
Yes, I would be interested in purchasing one. I did not have one of the originals, but do remember the design.
I mostly free-hand my fins, but this would be a collectable. Well, I've only been in the hobby for 40 years.
Chas
Charles Russell
NAR 9790
barone
10-01-2007, 09:33 PM
Sure...I'll take one....PM me with details.
roktdad
10-01-2007, 10:50 PM
I would also like to get one
Early Starts
10-01-2007, 11:00 PM
I would like one. Is the tool still around to start up production again?
scigs30
10-01-2007, 11:01 PM
I will take one. David
CraigF
10-01-2007, 11:03 PM
Me too! What's the info?
pantherjon
10-01-2007, 11:41 PM
I would like one as well! :) I remember seeing one at athe hobbie shop when I was a young teen..Never got the metal one..But a little later I did get the plastic version..Didn't last but 3 months and one of the pieces got broken-don't recall WHAT broke- but in a fit of anger I threw it on the floor and it broke into like 6 pieces..Straight to the trash it went..Was the low point in my early rocketry days, and probably the time I stepped away from rocketry til this Feb...
Our father was Mitch Gornik, the inventor of the origiinal metal Fin-Kwik. He was a tool and die maker who came up with the idea in response to my brother Mark's complaints about how hard it was to put fins on accurately. He made the original dies and had them stamped at a buddy's shop; my brothers and I did the threading and final packaging. Dad was proud of his invention and it was a real kick in the pants when Estes stopped buying from him and went to their plastic version. Anyway, I have about 20 FIN-KWIKS in their original packaging. If there is any interest please let me know. Happy rocketing. rgornik
I have one - bought it from Commonwealth Displays 20 odd years ago and still use it.
Personally, I think it's much more accurate than the plastic Estes version.
Sean
Initiator001
10-02-2007, 12:28 AM
I would, also, be interested in one of these.
Bob
Skippy
10-02-2007, 01:36 AM
What price rgornik? Do you take Paypal from us foreigners?
DeanHFox
10-02-2007, 02:49 AM
I'd be happy to purchase one of these.
mrhemi1971
10-02-2007, 05:48 AM
I would like to purchase one as well! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!!
mojo1986
10-02-2007, 07:56 AM
Yeah, I'd like to get one as well. Add my name to your list.
Joe
rocketguy101
10-02-2007, 12:28 PM
you mean like this (http://www.ninfinger.org/~sven/rockets/nostalgia/77est050.html)? How much are you asking for these? As asked before, what method of payment?
I wonder if some of the current mfgr would be interested in putting these back in production? There was alot of interest in them on the Estes forum (while it lasted)...
tfischer
10-02-2007, 12:48 PM
I'd be interested, if the price wasn't too high.
I'd also think there would be a lot of interest in a re-production of these...
-Tim
moonzero2
10-02-2007, 01:00 PM
Count me in,... I'm interested too.
Rocket Doctor
10-02-2007, 01:28 PM
Metal Fin Kwik patent #3,805,355
Fixture for model rocket
Inventor Mitchell Gornik, Addison IL
filed Dec 15,1972
patent granted April 23,1974
In my opinion, one of the greatest inventions for assembling model rockets.
Metal is better, a far cry from the plastic version.
snuggles
10-02-2007, 01:49 PM
Yes I would like one also.
Mark T
rgornik
10-02-2007, 04:07 PM
It was great to hear from all of you. I wish our dad were alive to know that his invention had such an enthusiastic crowd. I'm checking with my brothers about pricing and the like and will respond ASAP. l
I'd also like one.
PM sent.
Rocket Doctor
10-02-2007, 08:03 PM
It was great to hear from all of you. I wish our dad were alive to know that his invention had such an enthusiastic crowd. I'm checking with my brothers about pricing and the like and will respond ASAP. l
Your father was a genius, and it is too bad that he isn't with us since next year we will be celebrating the 50th anniversary of the hobby.....
Early Starts
10-02-2007, 11:03 PM
It was great to hear from all of you. I wish our dad were alive to know that his invention had such an enthusiastic crowd. I'm checking with my brothers about pricing and the like and will respond ASAP. l
I also joined just to respond to this...
Do you have any ideas about where the tooling (stamping dies) might be? You could fire up production on these again. If the tooling is gone, do the plans for the tools exist? Finally, if nothing exists, I could send one to someone to reverse engineer. When I am not playing with rockets I play a worldwide sourcing manager and and have some great contacts for this type of thing.
The biggest issue as I see it would be the tooling - would need to sell quite a few to make up the cost of the tools so if it is still sitting somewhere, that would be the best. Did your dad own the tooling or did Estes or someone else? If Estes owned it, they technically still would own it even if they forgot about it.
If there is no tooling, it would mean someone would need to fund some potentially expensive tooling up front without knowing they could sell many. If you didn't mind, I would be intersted in getting some quotes (once I buy one from you) and possibly making a batch of these.
Brian L Raney
10-03-2007, 02:21 AM
After arriving late to this party, it would be a privledge for me to also purchase one. :)
Rocket Doctor
10-03-2007, 05:25 AM
I also joined just to respond to this...
Do you have any ideas about where the tooling (stamping dies) might be? You could fire up production on these again. If the tooling is gone, do the plans for the tools exist? Finally, if nothing exists, I could send one to someone to reverse engineer. When I am not playing with rockets I play a worldwide sourcing manager and and have some great contacts for this type of thing.
The biggest issue as I see it would be the tooling - would need to sell quite a few to make up the cost of the tools so if it is still sitting somewhere, that would be the best. Did your dad own the tooling or did Estes or someone else? If Estes owned it, they technically still would own it even if they forgot about it.
If there is no tooling, it would mean someone would need to fund some potentially expensive tooling up front without knowing they could sell many. If you didn't mind, I would be intersted in getting some quotes (once I buy one from you) and possibly making a batch of these.
Estes came out with a completely different fin alignment guile, they changed it so trheir wouldn't be a patent infringement issue.
As you know, the Estes version was plastic, had tabs (that broke off) to hold the fin guides and usually warped.
There was only one fin kwik, the original metal one.
I have adsvocated it's return on the Estes Forum, and we did have a discussion at Estes to bring the plastic version back but upgraded. The bottom line was, they didn't feel the customer base was there to support the investment.
Shreadvector
10-03-2007, 08:28 AM
It was great to hear from all of you. I wish our dad were alive to know that his invention had such an enthusiastic crowd. I'm checking with my brothers about pricing and the like and will respond ASAP. l
I have one of these metal guides as well as the plastic knock-off.
I would love to get one or more additional metal originals for use by our club when we do classes. We will not be using them to glue all of the students' fins, rather we will show the students how to glue the fins manually and also how an excellent tool can be created and used to help. I love demonstrating basic techniques as well as alternate techniques.
So, let us all know about pricing and please let us know if any tooling exists for new production. You could probably sell quite a few (hundreds, maybe a couple of thousand) via web sales and eBay and if you got them into a large distributor nationwide you will sell thousands.
Thanks.
rocketguy101
10-03-2007, 12:24 PM
if you got them into a large distributor nationwide you will sell thousands.
Thanks.
Man, I am hoping Carl will jump all over this and start selling them. A "Retro Tool" if you will :cool:
sandman
10-04-2007, 12:45 AM
It was great to hear from all of you. I wish our dad were alive to know that his invention had such an enthusiastic crowd. I'm checking with my brothers about pricing and the like and will respond ASAP. l
That should be easy to price...$7.95 just like in the catalog. :rolleyes:
chanstevens
10-04-2007, 08:59 AM
Seems like the number of "count me in"'s has exceeded the 20 offered up, but I'll pile on as well. The plastic tool is junk, and the masterpiece Rose fin jig, at $350 plus mandrels is a bit pricey for me...
sandman
10-04-2007, 10:20 AM
It does look like if the price is good they will be scooped up in a hurry. Unfortunately, because of the scarcity/rarity of this obviously collectable item, they are worth much more than you would probably think.
Most of us would probably never take them out of the package.
It seems to me since the item is pattented (did I spell that right???) maybe you should try and find a small machine shop (there are quite a few around me) and see if you could have maybe 200 of them made.
Sell the originals at auction.
tfischer
10-04-2007, 10:52 AM
Most of us would probably never take them out of the package.
That's why I hate "collecting"...
When I collect things, I buy them to enjoy them, not because I hope to resell them "someday" for a big profit. If I wanted a big profit, I'd play the real-estate or stock markets... Collectables tend to only increase in value when nobody collects them...
I collect precision scale John Deere tractors and implements. I know a lot of collectors that just keep the things in the box, to preserve their value. Mine sit on a shelf, out of the box, where I can look at them, touch them, enjoy them, etc. Did they lose value because of that? Certainly. But I enjoy them, and most of them haven't really gained value in the past 10 years anyway (a few scarce models were soaring up to $400 on eBay for a time, but now the price has 'crashed' back to around $200...) Besides, I have no intentions of selling them, barring me completely losing interest in them, dying, or becoming so financially needy that I have to cash them out to pay the light bill...
Not trying to come down on you or any other collector. We all 'collect' for different reasons. If it makes you happy to buy a rocket, or a tool like this, and keep it in the package, knowing it's "mint in box", that's awesome. But I just wouldn't be happy doing that...
-Tim
sandman
10-04-2007, 05:19 PM
I didn't mean to hit a nerve.
I said "most" of us wouldn't take them out of the package, not all of us.
I'd use mine...if I had one. :rolleyes:
Can I have one? :o
CraigF
10-04-2007, 05:52 PM
I'd use it too. It's metal, what would happen to it if I used it (and didn't break it)? It should still be good.
I have a blue plastic one somewhere, it was more frustrating to use than anything. I think the time "it" messed up a set of fins was the last time I used it.
I can see leaving a few odd things in the sealed bag. Mainly very old simple kits, virtually no way to "prove" what they are unless sealed, the parts could otherwise be easily replaced.
CharlaineC
10-04-2007, 07:47 PM
I would love one of thease. please let me know how much?
tfischer
10-04-2007, 07:47 PM
I didn't mean to hit a nerve.
Sorry, I really didn't mean to make it sound like you did. I was just saying I don't understand collecting for collecting's sake. But like I said -- whatever makes people happy!
-Tim
CharlaineC
10-05-2007, 07:09 AM
I want one not to collec but to better my collection of rockets. I love nice streaght fins and would use it regularly. I would allow me to work on multiple rockets at the same time. :D
mrhemi1971
10-05-2007, 04:14 PM
I didn't mean to hit a nerve.
I said "most" of us wouldn't take them out of the package, not all of us.
I'd sure as heck use it as the tool gods intended! It'd be such a shame to let one sit in it's package and not realize it's full potential as a quality tool. LET IT BREATHE!!
barone
10-06-2007, 10:02 AM
Our father was Mitch Gornik, the inventor of the origiinal metal Fin-Kwik. He was a tool and die maker who came up with the idea in response to my brother Mark's complaints about how hard it was to put fins on accurately. He made the original dies and had them stamped at a buddy's shop; my brothers and I did the threading and final packaging. Dad was proud of his invention and it was a real kick in the pants when Estes stopped buying from him and went to their plastic version. Anyway, I have about 20 FIN-KWIKS in their original packaging. If there is any interest please let me know. Happy rocketing. rgornik
Okay Mitch....now that you've got everyone worked up, please note that I was number TWO on the request for one. So, you going to supply us any more details? :D
snaquin
10-06-2007, 02:47 PM
I hope Mitch checks his PM's too.
I sent a PM to Mitch on 10-01-2007 @ 08:39 PM about seven minutes after his post that hasn't received a confirmation yet.
.
mrhemi1971
10-16-2007, 04:12 PM
Anybody heard anything yet??
barone
10-16-2007, 04:56 PM
Nada..... :(
CharlaineC
10-16-2007, 11:21 PM
i dont know if it is because i;m a woman or because I think we are all over whelming mitch. But we need to give him breathing room and he will decide how he will work it out.
mrhemi1971
01-25-2008, 06:36 PM
Well, after a couple months breathing room, Did anybody hear a thing?
WOW! Finkwik.com!! Extemely entertaining thread! have ya'll gotten your factory sealed originals or do ya think they got/gonna get EBay'd?! :D
barone
01-25-2008, 07:49 PM
FWIW, an original was in a box of other rocketry items that sold on e-bay last week.....Went for $114. Granted, there were some other collectibles in the mix.
Rocket Doctor
01-25-2008, 10:00 PM
The son of the original designer only had about 25 originals in the boxes for sale. Apparently, with such a demand, he is looking into producing more.
Good going Gus, I find this very interesting. Sent a PM to him, with no reply????????
Mitchell Gornik (1972) patent #3,805,355 The original designer.
Ltvscout
01-25-2008, 11:04 PM
FWIW, an original was in a box of other rocketry items that sold on e-bay last week.....Went for $114. Granted, there were some other collectibles in the mix.
I've got a few of them here, but not sealed.
Scott,
Can you post a photo?
Ltvscout
01-26-2008, 08:29 AM
Scott,
Can you post a photo?
If I can un-earth one of them. ;)
Chas Russell
01-27-2008, 06:47 PM
Gee, would it be considered whining that I was the first one to respond to the first post and ask to purchase one of the original finkwiks?
Seriously, it would be nice to have one original or new build.
Chas
NAR 9790
Never a BAR
Certified Whiner...
Rocketflyer
01-28-2008, 06:12 AM
Gee, would it be considered whining that I was the first one to respond to the first post and ask to purchase one of the original finkwiks?
Seriously, it would be nice to have one original or new build.
Chas
NAR 9790
Never a BAR
Certified Whiner...
Chas, I'll whine along with you on geting one of the finqwiks :) :o
barone
01-28-2008, 07:11 AM
Gee, would it be considered whining that I was the first one to respond to the first post and ask to purchase one of the original finkwiks?
Seriously, it would be nice to have one original or new build.
Chas
NAR 9790
Never a BAR
Certified Whiner...
Okay...let me whiner number two since I made the second request. :(
foose4string
01-28-2008, 12:19 PM
Wow, this will be cool if the family can dig up the tooling and start production again! I'd take one, new or old...doesn't matter if it's the same design.
ScaleNut
01-28-2008, 05:23 PM
I asked for one too, had to be in the top 10 atleast ... ! no joy
DANLK66
02-22-2008, 08:24 AM
I would like one to but I think there are more than enough requests so far.
pantherjon
02-22-2008, 08:29 AM
Okay...let me whiner number two since I made the second request. :(
I will join the whine chorus, as I requested one as well..:( Sigh...
Like Chan said, it looks like demand has exceeded supply. Even so, I'd like to give it a try.
Please add me to the list of those who desire one.
Rocket Doctor
03-22-2008, 05:37 AM
I've got a few of them here, but not sealed.
The son of the designer MItchell Gornik has not responded to any requests for information or the purchase of the Original Fin Kwik.
There is a link to give suggestions http://finkwik.com/
Also, if you would like to view the patent,the patent number is 3,805,355 April 24, 1974
The Original metal Fin Kwik was sold by Estes going back around the 1975 time period and can be found in a catalog of that vintage.
I still have mine and it's a valuable tool in the construction of rockets.
AKPilot
03-22-2008, 07:26 AM
Given the opportunity, I'd also be in for one.
cwbullet
09-16-2008, 06:43 PM
Any word on when these might be available?
Ltvscout
09-16-2008, 07:06 PM
Any word on when these might be available?
The OP disappeared. The website/domain name he had reserved awhile back is gone as well. :(
I almost hate to mention it, but a friend and I will be introducing two tools aimed at the model rocketry community some time later this year. A lot of product testing will be done prior to official announcement. This thread just sparked my desire to "leak" a little information.
1. Fin Sanding Table, using a Dremel Moto-Tool
2. Fin Attachment Jig (entirely different in concept from the Fin-Kwik)
I've used an early prototype of the first for some time, but it will not go into production as-is. It was made of aluminum, and cost prohibitive for mass appeal. The replacement will be a machined polymer. Designed using SolidWorks, it will offer greater accuracy and easier adjustment than its predecessor.
2. On the Fin Attachment Tool, I cannot give out too much information yet, other than to say the device will be simple, and simple to use, and quite reasonable. This is not going to be a $100 tool, as I imagine Fin-Kwiks are fetching.
Bottom Line: Good value, high quality
barone
09-16-2008, 09:46 PM
I almost hate to mention it, but a friend and I will be introducing two tools aimed at the model rocketry community some time later this year. A lot of product testing will be done prior to official announcement. This thread just sparked my desire to "leak" a little information.
1. Fin Sanding Table, using a Dremel Moto-Tool
2. Fin Attachment Jig (entirely different in concept from the Fin-Kwik)
I've used an early prototype of the first for some time, but it will not go into production as-is. It was made of aluminum, and cost prohibitive for mass appeal. The replacement will be a machined polymer. Designed using SolidWorks, it will offer greater accuracy and easier adjustment than its predecessor.
2. On the Fin Attachment Tool, I cannot give out too much information yet, other than to say the device will be simple, and simple to use, and quite reasonable. This is not going to be a $100 tool, as I imagine Fin-Kwiks are fetching.
Bottom Line: Good value, high quality
I'll be more than happy to do some product testing for you..... :D
cwbullet
09-16-2008, 09:58 PM
I build 5-7 rockets a week. I am willing to do any testing needed and will even pay for a prototype.
Thanks, and I will let everyone know how testing goes, and certainly offer up a few prototypes. Just not ready to do so yet!
With the disappearance of Mr. Fin-Kwik (or was it Son of Mr. Fin-Kwik?), I wanted to mention I've got something in the works. But I've got to thoroughly test it myself and then offer it up for opinions, and some independent testing.
Here is a picture of the older, aluminum fin sander. It is pretty crude compared with the latest incarnation developed using today's 3D design capabilities, but it still works really well. The new model should be dramatically better. This project is further along than the fin alignment jig, but stay tuned.
http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii220/hobbes_pics/Miscellaneous%20Rockets/th_fin-sander.jpg (http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii220/hobbes_pics/Miscellaneous%20Rockets/fin-sander.jpg)
Thanks, and I will let everyone know how testing goes, and certainly offer up a few prototypes. Just not ready to do so yet!
With the disappearance of Mr. Fin-Kwik (or was it Son of Mr. Fin-Kwik?), I wanted to mention I've got something in the works. But I've got to thoroughly test it myself and then offer it up for opinions, and some independent testing.
Here is a picture of the older, aluminum fin sander. It is pretty crude compared with the latest incarnation developed using today's 3D design capabilities, but it still works really well. The new model should be dramatically better. This project is further along than the fin alignment jig, but stay tuned.
http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii220/hobbes_pics/Miscellaneous%20Rockets/th_fin-sander.jpg (http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii220/hobbes_pics/Miscellaneous%20Rockets/fin-sander.jpg)
You can put me down for one! I'm always on the lookout for ways to do it better/faster.
Ltvscout
09-16-2008, 10:37 PM
I almost hate to mention it, but a friend and I will be introducing two tools aimed at the model rocketry community some time later this year. A lot of product testing will be done prior to official announcement. This thread just sparked my desire to "leak" a little information.
1. Fin Sanding Table, using a Dremel Moto-Tool
2. Fin Attachment Jig (entirely different in concept from the Fin-Kwik)
That's great news, Lee. I'm looking forward to seeing your new products.
Rocketflyer
09-17-2008, 06:40 AM
That's great news, Lee. I'm looking forward to seeing your new products.
I'll echo LTVscout, and say that a fin jig will definitely be on my list as a must have. :)
pantherjon
09-17-2008, 09:00 AM
I too would be interested in the fin jig as well! I think I live in a crooked house, every time I draw the placement lines on a tube using a door jam the lines are all askew, just enough to be noticeable..:mad:
gpoehlein
09-17-2008, 12:32 PM
I too would be interested in the fin jig as well! I think I live in a crooked house, every time I draw the placement lines on a tube using a door jam the lines are all askew, just enough to be noticeable..:mad:
One simple solution, next time you are at your LHS (assuming you have one), pick up a piece of brass angle (maybe 1/4" wide). If you lay it against the BT, it will settle down straight, and it's span is small enough to give you a straight edge on almost any size BT.
Greg
One simple solution, next time you are at your LHS (assuming you have one), pick up a piece of brass angle (maybe 1/4" wide). If you lay it against the BT, it will settle down straight, and it's span is small enough to give you a straight edge on almost any size BT.
Greg
I use a 1/2" aluminum angle from Lowes for *most* of my body tubes. I need the 1/4" for the BT-5's
Shreadvector
09-17-2008, 03:11 PM
I too would be interested in the fin jig as well! I think I live in a crooked house, every time I draw the placement lines on a tube using a door jam the lines are all askew, just enough to be noticeable..:mad:
I demonstrate this at every class I teach and I emphasize the number one cause of wavy lines (as I discovered myself as a youth): You must find a straight door frame with a step for the tube to rest in. Then lay the pen or pencil flat on the wall and move it up and down flat on the wall to make the line. It you hold the pen or pencil in your hand, the tip will move and the line on the tube will be wavy or slanted.
The angle extrusion is great for drawing lines and we also demonstrate that as well.
Then we demonstrate how to do the 'double glue' technique with yellow glue and how fast the fins set.
tbzep
09-17-2008, 08:07 PM
None of my door frames are straight. I use the sliding rail on my computer keyboard drawer for some lines, and on others I use a nice piece of aluminum angle stock.
One simple solution, next time you are at your LHS (assuming you have one), pick up a piece of brass angle (maybe 1/4" wide). If you lay it against the BT, it will settle down straight, and it's span is small enough to give you a straight edge on almost any size BT.
Greg
I've bought 1" aluminum angle from Home Depot, and will definitely have to look for small brass angle. Had never thought to look at the LHS.
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