PDA

View Full Version : Dr. Zooch Return to Flight Space Shuttle build thread...


luke strawwalker
03-04-2009, 12:01 PM
Since the crash of TRF wiped out all the great info on the Zooch Shuttle build, and since I bought one of these kits last October, and since I figured I could use some more 'conventional' glider experience before diving into my Zooch Lifting Body rocket, and since it's great fun to do build threads, I offer the Zooch Space Shuttle build thread #2...

I wanted to start this last week but was 'unavoidably detained' by work and home issues which lasted on into this week, including missing work yesterday morning to take my sister to the ER after she passed out in her bathroom from dehydration brought on by stomach flu. 3 IV bags later she was much better and sent home just in time for me to make my afternoon bus route.

Anyway, I'm starting from scratch and there's a lot going on around here still, and this is a lot longer build than I've undertaken lately, so the build part of this thread is going to be an ongoing effort for awhile. I hope you guys will pitch in with your experiences, tips, and ideas as we go along, and maybe we can reformulate a lot of the good information that was in the original thread, now lost.

First off, I've been reading the instructions and checking over the parts list. Everything looks to be there and in good order. The instructions seem to be fairly involved but this is a fairly complicated kit, so that's to be expected. The parts and stuff look to be the usual high quality yet no frills Zooch stuff I've come to expect.

One thing I've had to learn is, to just trust Wes's instructions and go about building the kit pretty much as he describes, though sometimes I DO switch the order around a bit, working on something three steps ahead while waiting on the glue or paint to dry on something else, just to shorten build time. Sorta 'parallel development' in ant scale... The reason I mention this 'trusting the instructions' is that I've gotten rather used to having to 'second guess' the instructions that come with a lot of rockets made by the largest model rocket manufacturer who shall remain nameless... I've found that some of the materials they use and procedures they recommend are 'less than ideal' or rather shaky, and leave some DEFINITE room for improvement. I've even learned not to trust all their motor recommendations, through bitter experience of late. Having developed this 'healthy skepticism' of the kit instructions, transferring that over to Zooch kits became habit, but I've learned that, "Hey, whaddya know, Wes really DID do his homework and wrote instructions that work, what a refreshing idea"... I hear Master Yoda's voice behind me telling me, "You must UNLEARN, what you have LEARNED". While I have a few tricks that make things easier, I haven't found any obvious "gotcha's" in the Zooch kits or instructions, unlike some of my recent experiences with the big "E".

So, let me return to my reading and get organized and we'll get started. More later! OL JR :)

luke strawwalker
03-04-2009, 02:00 PM
I'm hoping that Dr. Zooch will chime in here and repost the formulas and methods for doing the 'Zooch treatment' for painting the ET... Of course with old Krylon now joining the dodos and dinosaurs, we'll probably have to come up with something new for those unable to locate the Old Formula Krylon colors required...

The reason I mention this now is, I'd like to do a paint test to see if I can make it work, and familiarize myself with the technique.

Here's a tip I've found so far... Look for Krylon Farm and Implement paint... It still seems to be the old formulation so far... After scrounging through all the local hardware stores and auto parts and farm stores, I came up with:

1. one can of Krylon Rust Tough Ruddy Brown Primer, #9204
2. one can of Krylon Farm and Implement Old Equipment Yellow, #1819
3. one can of Krylon Farm and Implement Allis Chalmers Orange, #1820

Now, there's a small problem here from the original "Zooch method": The recommended Orange was "Pumpkin Orange". I checked at Grainger's and from what they could find out, Pumpkin Orange is no longer available in the lacquers-- it's not in their catalog, in searching their system and vendor info they couldn't find any current mention of it, and I've only found it in the new Krylon formulation, which would be of dubious use applying it with the lacquers, even as a 'mist treatment'. Maybe it would work, maybe not, but I'd do a paint test first on a spare tube. I did some comparison shopping and it appears that the Allis Chalmers Orange is just a little darker than the pumpkin orange, but I bet it ends up virtually identical, since I've painted stuff AC Orange before and it's pretty darn bright! Certainly not dayglo but it's a pretty vibrant orange! Old Equipment Yellow is pretty hard to find too; from my comparison shopping, the New Caterpillar Yellow appears just a shade darker than the OEY. Perhaps going with something like John Deere Yellow, which is just a shade brighter, coupled with the shade darker AC Orange would offset, but I don't know for sure... test, test, test...

If the Doc will repost his 'Zooch method' and some pics, and if I can duplicate it decently on a test tube, I'll spring for a few cans of more readily available competitive products and see if I can't get a good match.

Someone else (sorry escapes me at the moment who) suggested "Totally Tangerine" in New Krylon as a good match for the ET, so if yall have pics to demonstrate, I'd love to see em!

More later! OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-05-2009, 03:02 PM
I got some of the new flavor Pumpkin Orange today to do some test shots... and I also lucked out and actually found a few cans of ORIGINAL Krylon Ruddy Brown Primer #1317! I think they had the better part of a case. There were a few older colors still there-- Celery, that 'appliance baby blue' and other weird/odd pastels that I pretty much puke at, but no Original Pumpkin Orange, and I've been looking for that stuff EVERYWHERE for a good while, so it's pretty much gone AFAICT.

Anyway, gotta head to the bus barn soon but I'll try to do some test shots tomorrow... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-07-2009, 10:40 PM
I did the paint test today while changing the oil in my wife's truck late this afternoon, but I didn't have time to get any daylight shots today... yall will have to settle for kitchen table shots and flash shots til tomorrow.

I started with a ~3 inch tube that I had on hand (shipping tube) that I covered with typing paper last night to avoid the 'fuzzies'. I performed three tests on three seperate types of materials just to compare/contrast. It was rather windy today so I painted them in the farm shop, which isn't lit too well, so please forgive any blotches...

I can't figure out how to insert the pics into the text so I'll just do a couple seperate posts for the individual tests. First, the family photos. The first shot is natural incandescent light and the second and third are flash, and the fourth and fifth pics are daylight shots.

More to come. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-07-2009, 10:47 PM
Okay, test 1 consisted basically the way Dr. Zooch explained how to do the paint job on the tank. I started off with a base coat of Krylon Farm and Implement #1819 Old Equipment Yellow, which is basically old Caterpillar Yellow. Next I did a mist coat at a distance and making FAST passes with the can with the closest thing I could find, which is Krylon Farm and Implement Allis Chalmers Orange #1820, instead of the recommended Pumpkin Orange which I cannot find anywhere. Lastly I made a mist coat at a distance with fast passes of Krylon #1317 Ruddy Brown Primer, which I wanted to try in lieu of the Krylon Rust Tough Enamel Primer #9204 which I have and is recommended, just to see how it would work. I found that I didn't have quite the coverage I wanted, so I went over it again with a second mist coat of all three colors until I had the coverage and color balance I was looking for. Basically I only gave it a couple minutes to 'tack up' between each coat.

I notice in looking closely at the finished product, that the Old Krylon produces the most 'pebbly' surface of the three tests. If feels like 220 grit (or maybe a bit finer) to the touch. The colors are well blended, but perhaps a tiny bit grainier looking than the other two. Overall I think it looks great.

Here's the pics... First a natural light shot, second is a flash shot, third is a daylight shot, fourth is closeup with camera on macro mode.

luke strawwalker
03-07-2009, 10:50 PM
For test 2, I switched to "new" formula Krylon. I started with a base coat of "Bauhaus Gold" which is a little darker, golder yellow than the sun yellow. Next a mist coat at high speed with "Pumpkin Orange", followed by a mist coat at high speed of the "Ruddy Brown Primer"

A word of warning... when you buy a can of NEW Krylon, before you leave the store, pop open the cap and make sure the "new improved" turnable fan nozzle is intact... there is a red nozzle 'body' and a small white plastic wedge-shaped nozzle that snaps into it, and when I opened my can, the white nozzle tip was missing from the nozzle body. I figured "so what" since I was putting on the base coat and didn't need fine atomization, and the stuff just puked out all over the test object and me. Improvising I snatched the nozzle body and tip off the Pumpkin Orange and interchanged the nozzle throughout the rest of the test. I have to say I HATE the new nozzle-- it puts out a LOT of paint, and it doesn't atomize worth a darn. The droplet size is really too big for my liking. To get a 'mist' coat on the part, I had to hold the can about 2-3 feet back and "whip" the can past the tank tube at high speed to get a light enough coat-- if you move slower you will get too much paint on and cover up your undercoat. Krylon REALLY screwed up, because they could save a ton of money and have a lot better results just going back to a plain-jane one-piece push button nozzle like the cheapy paints have. The 'solid cone' nozzles on the cheapy paint atomize MUCH finer and are 'omnidirectional'. I just tipped the can on it's side since I didn't want to get more paint on me realigning the 'handy' twist flat fan pattern nozzle on the new Krylon.

I found that I had to 'work more' with this paint but the finished result is more than acceptable. You really have to 'whip' the cans around to get a light enough coat, and I had to make 2-3 coats to get the coverage and blend and color matching that I wanted. It laid down smooth, much smoother than the OLD Krylon, without the 'pebbly' sandpaper grit-like effect, but it certainly didn't lay down 'gloss smooth'. There is still a slight texture to it. I'd say it works pretty darn well, considering.

Here's the pics... first a natural incandescent light shot, second is a flash shot, third is daylight, fourth is closeup with camera on macro.

luke strawwalker
03-07-2009, 10:52 PM
Lastly, for the third test, I played around a bit with different brands of paint, just to see if they played nice together, in what I call the 'hybrid test'. It's also likely to be the cheapest test, which appeals to me since I'm a cheapskate

First I laid down a base coat of Walmart house brand Colorplace #20011 Red Primer, which is almost a match for the Ruddy Brown Primer but only 99 cents a can. Next, a mist coat of NEW Krylon "Pumpkin Orange" and then a mist coat of New Krylon "Bauhaus Gold". I had to make 2-3 more coats to get the coverage and color balance I wanted, but it went slightly easier now that I had some experience with the New Krylon. The Walmart Colorplace Red Primer has a plain-jane solid-cone spray pattern nozzle, and it goes on finely atomized and very smooth. Of course the New Krylon has those stupid flat-fan pattern two-piece twistable nozzles that put out thick, coarse, and fast.

Up close, the finished product is certainly the smoothest of the three. It feels pretty darn smooth to the touch, though it's not 'gloss smooth', but definitely has less 'tooth' than #2 and OBVIOUSLY less than #1. The color itself looks slightly less well blended than the others, giving it a 'grittier' appearance despite it's smoother finish. It looks something like a pattern a printer might produce on VERY close inspection. At a foot distance beside me now, it looks virtually identical to the others.

Here's the pics-- first the natural incandescent light and second is the flash pic, third is daylight, fourth is closeup with camera on macro. Hope this helps folks contemplating how to do the foam color. More later! OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-08-2009, 06:48 PM
I added the daylight shots I took this afternoon to the paint test posts above. Here also is a couple pics of some hot stuff foam I pulled off the bottom corner of my brother's shop. He tells me the foam has been exposed to sunlight for about 6 months or so. Note the yellow color of the virgin foam and the orange coloration with sun exposure.

Later! OL JR :)

luke strawwalker
03-16-2009, 03:53 PM
FINALLY... now that spring break is here, I can actually get down to the build!!!

I started off using the provided tube marking guide to mark the main BT-60 External Tank tube, which is the backbone of the stack, for the positions of the Solid Rocket Boosters, the Shuttle attach pad, and the engine hook locations. These are all clocked at the cardinal points to each other like fins. I use my handy angles to square the lines down the length of the tube.

OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-16-2009, 03:54 PM
Next up, put a line the squarely along the length of the SRB. Mark the tube at 13/16 from the bottom end, and cut the SRB aft cones from the wrap sheet, and glue them up. I took my handy-dandy hemostat clamps over to the shop last week and took the die grinder to them, and carefully and lightly ground the teeth off of them, making them smooth jawed. Now they work GREAT for clamping up stuff like the SRB aft cones while the glue dries.

I also took the nosecones outside, for both SRB's and the ET, and hardened them with CA glue. Then, I sanded them lightly to take the hardened 'fuzz' off them, and tried out my new tub of wood filler with microspheres. This stuff goes on like concrete, as you can see in the pics. It does sand out well though-- after you take 99% of it off.

I went ahead and worked on the SRB's while the filler was drying, by installing the SRB aft cones, and their stiffening rings. I carefully trimmed the rings down at an angle with a NEW hobby knife blade (don't try using a used one; you need the keenest edge you can get for this) and then just lightly finish sanding them. I think they'd have turned out a bit nicer if I'd just sanded them to the taper as the instructions indicate, but I'd have ended up sanding for a LONG time and figured I'd try trimming them down, but if you do, I'd advise a little more finish sanding to get them down smoother than I did.

Once I test fitted everything, I glued it up and left it overnight to dry. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-16-2009, 03:55 PM
This morning I went back to work on the SRB's. I noticed that I stupidly overlooked something in the instructions, which is, that I should have pushed the SRB aft cones and stiffener rings up to the 13/16 mark on the tubes, instead of leaving them flush with the aft end of the tube. So, I have 'nozzleless' SRB's. I went ahead and carefully cut out the SRB wraps from one of the wrap sheets, and rolled them up tight to preform them. (One other thing I'd advise with Zooch kits-- pull the wrap sheets and instructions out of the kit and store them flat under some heavy books or something for awhile before you build the kit-- they're shipped rolled up tightly inside the main body tube of the kit, and sometimes they're rolled the opposite way from how they go on the tube because of how they're printed on the sheet, so storing them flat for a while really helps later on to get them to go on nicely) I glued the edges per the instructions, aligned the edge with the line on the tube, and carefully rolled them on. I decided to just trim the little bit of ring from the top, that should have been on the bottom if I had put the aft cones and rings on right, so the wrap would be flush with the top end of the tube and the front edge of the aft cones as they were meant to be.

I put the SRB together to see how they looked, and set them aside to dry.
I also went ahead and sanded the cones down to get them smooth and ready for priming.

The BT-60 ET cone has some unusual instructions. The noseweight is offset to counteract the weight/drag of the shuttle orbiter hanging off the side of the tank, so you roll the cone (be sure you sand the filler down smooth before you do this, so it rolls easily and true) and let it rock back and forth to find the 'top' of the cone opposite the offset noseweight. I marked the 'top' with a small tick mark, and then put a line along the cone shoulder about 15 degrees off clockwise as the instructions indicated, where the cable tunnel will later go. This 'clocks' the counterweight opposite the orbiter when preparing the stack for flight. I went ahead and masked the shoulders with masking tape, and primed the cones.

More to come... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-16-2009, 03:59 PM
I also went ahead and installed the intertank wrap on the ET tube. It consists of a piece of corrugated cardstock paper that simulates the corrugated stringers of the intertank region on the shuttle ET between the oxygen and hydrogen tanks. Wrap it around the ET carefully, and mark where it overlaps so it can be cut to the proper length. While you've got it wrapped, I'd recommend going ahead and carefully drawing a line around the top edge of the wrap 1/4 inch from the top edge of the tube-- this helps to roll it on straight. Not in the instructions and not completely necessary, but it helped me Anyway, once you've marked the wrap, carefully cut it to the proper length per the instructions, apply white glue to the back of it, and carefully roll it onto the tube. Be sure you clock the seam to the proper line as indicated in the instructions. It looks really good once it goes on.

Now here I'm going to depart from the instructions for the aft end of the ET tube. The kit includes a cut-out from the wrap sheet for a conical shroud around the engine mount tube to the ET body tube to simulate the aft Hydrogen tank dome, which on the real ET is a spherical/ellipsoidal structure consisting of curved tank dome gores welded together. I wanted to replicate this 'rounded' look a little better than a tapered shroud would do, so I put on my thinking cap and started looking around for 'round stuff' that would be lightweight and of the proper size. I finally found something suitable, and so here goes.

I started off by 'borrowing' the foam egg container from the refrigerator. Luckily we were about out of eggs and so between breakfast tacos and transferring what was left to another package, we now have our raw material. Invert the egg container and inspect the rounded foam cups the eggs sit in. I had a couple that were wrinkled, dinged, or had some small holes punched in them from the egg packing machinery. Once you locate a few nice looking egg cups, get a fresh SHARP hobby blade and carefully cut them out. My egg container had rounded 'troughs' between the egg cups to strengthen the container-- carefully cut straight down through these and then link the cuts together around the circumference of the egg cup. The corner ones work especially well for this, if they aren't dinged or wrinkled. You might even volunteer to help with the shopping and buy the eggs yourself, and make sure you get a nice egg container for the purpose. Of course you might also get some funny looks, inverting several packs of eggs in the store to find the nicest egg container Just explain to anyone who asks that you're looking for the perfect aft space shuttle tank dome, and they'll be satisfied that your nuts and will go away and leave you alone. Of course they may also call security, so don't dawdle-- pick a good egg container and let's go.

Once you've cut out the egg cup, put it rounded side up on your workbench. Mine had a small 'flat' area at the bottom apex of the egg cup. Carefully center your BT-20 engine tube from the kit on the flat bottom center, and outline it with a pencil. With your sharp hobby knife (I keep saying sharp, because don't try to reuse a blade you've already cut balsa and paper with, as the egg foam will tear rather than cut and look horrible, forcing you to scramble (hehe, a pun) to find another egg cup suitable for carving, and hopefully you'll have switched to a sharp blade by then and don't haggle it all up too) Anyway, carefully cut the hole out of the bottom of the egg cup for the motor tube. It should be a fairly snug fit so cut precisely on the line or just inside it. Remove the divot from the center and test fit it on the motor tube.

This is where it gets interesting, and what took me a couple tries to figure out. Now you have to mark the side of the egg cup so it will precisely fit up against the ET tube. First, test fit your centering rings for the motor mount inside the tube, and sand to fit nicely if required. Mock up the engine mount, and slide the rings inside the ET tube, BUT DON'T GLUE UP ANYTHING!!! This is strictly installing the centering rings in the ET tube with the motor tube slid into the rings. Push the bottom ring up inside the ET tube about 3/8 inch, to make room for the 'dome' over the motor tube to slide up inside the ET tube. Slide the tank dome over the motor tube, domed side down, and slide it down the motor tube until the outer edge is flush against the ET tube. Then, carefully holding it tightly against the tube, mark it all the way around with your pencil. This will mark the dome square to both tubes. Take the dome off. Now, carefully trim the dome, ABOUT 1/16 INCH OR SO PAST THE PENCIL RING (ON THE LARGER DIAMETER PART) you just drew on the dome when you marked it against the ET tube. This will allow for the proper clearance to make the dome sit FLUSH with the outer edge of the ET tube when it's glued on. You don't want it hanging over, or not coming to the outside diameter of the ET tube when it's installed. Carefully cut off the excess ring to create the dome. Test fit it over the motor mount parts-- remove the motor tube and pull the ring flush to the rear of the ET tube, reinsert the motor tube, and carefully test fit the dome over the motor tube. It doesn't matter if the motor tube sticks out past it at this point-- this is strictly to test the fit of the dome against the bottom of the ET tube. If it's overhanging the edge a bit, creating a 'lip', carefully trim it again with your hobby knife, very gently carving off a small ring around the edge until it fits flush. Be careful to trim it squarely as you go-- keep the cut parallel to the pencil ring drawn around the dome. Eh viola-- instant spheriodal tank dome!
While you have the motor mount parts installed in the ET tube, go ahead and push the motor tube ALMOST FLUSH with the bottom of the 'dome'. Remove the dome, and make sure that the aft motor mount centering ring is flush with the bottom of the ET tube as per in the instructions, and then reinstall the dome, and make sure the motor tube is just BARELY protruding from the dome, and once you're satisfied everything is properly located, remove the dome and mark the motor tube where it enters the aft centering ring, so you can install the centering ring on the motor tube in the proper place. Also mark 'bottom end' or something on the motor tube, so you don't put it together upside down. Remove the motor tube and centering rings from the ET tube.

You can now assemble the motor mount as per the instructions. The lower centering ring SHOULD be almost exactly 3/8 inch from the rear edge of the motor tube, as the instructions indicate. Once the motor mount is assembled, install it in the ET tube as the instructions indicate, with the aft centering ring flush with the aft end of the ET tube. Be sure to clock the engine hook to the proper point on the side of the ET tube, as indicated by the marks on the template in step one. Take the tank dome, and trim a 1/8 inch by 1/8 inch square out of the engine tube hole on one side, to clear the engine hook. Once the motor mount is glued in, go ahead and glue on the tank dome with white glue. Smear a good coat inside it, put a bead around the edge of the tank dome, and smear a decent coat on the OUTSIDE END of the motor tube-- BE CAREFUL NOT TO GET GLUE INSIDE THE MOTOR TUBE, and then slide the dome over the motor tube, aligning the 1/8 inch square notch with the motor hook, and then CAREFULLY put a VERY THIN bead of glue around the edge of the tank dome where it joins the motor tube. AGAIN, BE VERY CAREFUL NOT TO GET ANY GLUE INSIDE THE MOTOR TUBE. Smooth the edge where it joins the ET tube as well. Don't worry about smearing excess glue over the dome itself; we'll have to 'paint' it with a few layers of glue to seal it for priming and painting anyway. Just make sure the glue is smeared on smoothly.

Here's the pics. The first pic is obtaining sample tank domes from the egg carton, the second is marking the engine tube on the bottom flat, the third is the engine tube hole cut in the bottom, the fourth is the 'mocked up' engine mount centering rings and tank dome almost ready for marking, and the fifth pic is how you mark the outer circumference on the tank dome. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-16-2009, 04:00 PM
Here are the rest of the pics of the 'egg carton tank dome' I came up with.

The first pic is how you mark the ET diameter onto the tank dome egg cup, the second pic is test fitting after the dome has been cut out, and the third pic is the finished product. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-16-2009, 04:02 PM
Now we're getting to the hard part-- cutting the orbiter mounts and the orbiter itself.

Start off by cutting out the orbiter mounts as instructed, sanding the bevels into the ends, cutting the mount pad and gluing it up, sanding the orbiter mounting dowel notches in it, and gluing it up. Once I got the parts cut and started gluing them up, I set them aside to dry, and started cutting out the orbiter parts.

Start with the crew cabin of the orbiter. It is a complex shape on the wrap sheet. I wonder how long it took Wes to regain his sanity after trying to figure out how to make that shape a flat pattern for a printer!!! Anyway, as with everything, CAREFULLY cut it out. You'll need a breather when you're done if you're like me, because this thing is all curves and intersecting angles and stuff. Be sure you follow the instructions on gluing it up, as there is a definite order here to get it to go together properly. Smear white glue on the appropriate tabs, and set it aside to dry, preferably with a clothespin clamp or smooth jawed hemostat to make sure it stays clamped properly.

Cut out the bulkheads from the wrap sheets and trace them onto balsa, and cut them out. I went ahead and glued the patterns to the balsa to make sure they cut smoothly and properly, and for perhaps a bit of strength. That adds weight though. Anyway, cut the bottom out per the instructions, and cut the payload bay out, and glue it up per the instructions. Be careful gluing it up, because again, there's a definite order to things. Once this stuff is started, set it aside to dry. That brings me up to date-- I started last night at about 7 or 8 and worked til just after 11, and started again this morning at 9:30 and worked until about noon, so this is going quicker than I thought it would. More to come later!

Here's the pics related to this post... Enjoy! OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-18-2009, 11:51 AM
Seeing the finished product just reminds me how far I have to go... I've probably already made a hash of my glider... LOL I build heavy, what can I say??

I KNOW I goofed up the payload bay a bit... I used the edge of a steel ruler to turn the glue tabs for a nice sharp edge; unfortunately I didn't realize that I put one of my heavy meathooks down on the wrap and put an inch long crease in one of the bay doors near the back. I probably should have trimmed my bulkheads a bit more before installing them in the payload bay ends as well, because I can see the 'points' where the flat sides start turning round across the top, and they were a tight fit. The center of the payload bay isn't exactly rounding out as much as I'd like, either-- it's still 'hooped' or humpbacked more than I'd prefer. Probably should have 'precurled' it more... (did I do that at all?? can't recall...) Oh well, I'm learning; this is my first 'paper model' so to speak, and I probably picked a doosey to start on, but I'm holding my own I guess...

I was rather proud of how the crew cabin turned out, and the OMS pods... I DEFINITELY precurled them, the glue tabs and front edge, and curled the side 'points' (on top of the glue tabs when done) inward, to get that nice, compound, rounded rectangular look of the real thing. I was gonna put balsa bulkheads at the rear, but elected to stiffen them with a layer of white glue poured in the back and swished around to seal the seams and stiffen the paper from the inside. Hope that doesn't add too much aft weight.

I put a goodly glob of white glue in the nose after installing the clay noseweight as per the instructions, and swished it around to help stiffen the cabin.

One other thing I did that probably shouldn't have... I just glued the paper bulkhead templates to the balsa and then cut them out... for extra strength. Not sure how much weight that'll add... I did the same for the adjusting screw and elastic hook plate on the back-- adds a LOT of strength, but also some weight in about the worst place for it. I plan on adding the SSME nozzles, but I'll probably trim them down a bit first, since my back edges are a bit rough.

Other than that, I'm going stock with the orbiter, though I DO want that bottom wrap-- it's just too cool NOT to use! I'd like wing skins on top, but that's probably not a good idea this go round... Block I shuttles are too heavy anyway (grins). I'll settle for CA hardening the balsa and a sanded off coat of Elmer's filler, and a thin coat of white spray paint.

Here's some more pics... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-18-2009, 11:53 AM
I've also gone back to the SRB's and installed the paper bands over the printed ones. They REALLY make the SRB's look SO cool, though the pictures don't really do them justice. I cut the black and white bands at 1/16 inch to more closely match the bands on the printed wraps, and to allow the 'gold bands' adjoining some of the black and white bands to show through under or over the raised black or white bands. The effect is REALLY neat.

I figured out a fairly painless way to apply the white glue to the back of the strips, once I was about halfway through. I took a plastic box of wire nuts I had on the workbench and put a nice size drop of white glue on top, and smeared it around a bit, about half the size of a penny, and then simply dragged the back of the strip across the glue and out onto the plastic surface-- instant even thin layer of glue. Switch ends and do the other end and it's ready to roll onto the SRB. Every so often, use a paper towel or Kleenex to wipe up the remaining glue on the box before it dries, and put down a new drop and spread it. Works like a champ.

I also went back and finished the detailing on the ET. Installed the final 2 orbiter mount pegs on the base plate, the LOX tunnel, and the cable tray per the instructions. I also went back and spread a couple healthy layers of Titebond II dark on the aft hydrogen tank dome egg carton to seal it against heat and spray paint solvent. One more layer and she should be good to go.

Still need to do the forward attach bipod for the orbiter. When I did the aft struts, I carved a small notch in the tube to 'seat' the dowel into the tank wall itself, and used Titebond II dark for (hopefully) a little more strength than white glue, especially considering the wood.

Here's the pics... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-18-2009, 11:54 AM
Here's the pics of the sealing the aft hydrogen tank dome with Titebond II dark...

My idea of using the acrylic Testors water based paint I got at W/M to seal the aft ET dome seems to be a bust... the stuff is absolutely awful! I tried brushing it on the nosecones, and the darn stuff is like watercolors! Honestly, I think my daughter's 99 cent 'paint kit' (the little plastic sheet with dimples in it with powdered 'paint' you dip your brush in water and than rub the paint to make the color 'paint' you want) would do just as good a job, if not better. So, today I'll just get a spray can and go outside and do it. Probably shoot the ET cone white too just for a good base coat, since it's so highly noticeable out there in front.

Later! OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-20-2009, 11:57 PM
Okay, back to work... So, I pretty much finished with the ET, after giving the aft dome one more coat of Titebond II dark and after it dried, I did put a coat of the acrylic white on it just to make double sure it's sealed.

I had cut the dowels and NOTCHED the tiny suckers for the front bipod (notched the two 'bipod' dowels to hold the front shuttle attach dowel between them) and then had a change of heart. I figured that wouldnt' hold up more than one flight if I was lucky, and just went ahead and did the balsa block method instead. I DID sand it into a sorta 'topless pyramid' (I know, sounds like a REALLY bad theme strip bar in Vegas) and notched it for the forward shuttle attach dowel. After carefully measuring the location of the forward attach lug in relation to the body flap lugs, I then located the forward attach point on the ET. I had to make a tiny notch in the bottom of the intertank wrap, lightly sanded the glassine off the spot, and glued it to the tube. I halved the remaining launch lug per the instructions, (though I halved it at an angle to make it 'raked' and cut the back at an angle too just for kicks) and located them on the tube as well. One is nestled up close to the hydrogen feedline on the rear shuttle attach pad, and the other is nestled up right against the forward shuttle attach block. SO it's a good thing I went for the wood block method instead of the bipod dowel method, because they would have probably been in the way of the forward lug if I had used the dowels.

I also went ahead and built the flamefins to stabilize the stack in flight. I halved the BT-5 tube per the instructions, put the alignment marks on them per the alignment sheet in the kit (you actually mark the fins as if you were installing four, but you put them at 12, 3 and 6 positions, instead of 12, 4, and 8 positions like you normally would for three fins. Basically you're leaving off the fourth fin.) I cut 6 flame fins from the last sheet of kit balsa, and had a devil of a time getting them all on there with the grain running properly, but making the front tip a hair shorter did the trick. I glued the fins on, hardened them with CA, sanded them smooth, and glued on the two forward mounting rings. They slide into the SRB's for flight, sorta like a removeable motor mount with fins... The fit was a little loose, so I went ahead and painted the rings as well, since that will probably snug them up a bit. I got a can of 7747 Sunburst Yellow in Rustoleum brand to paint them, as it was the brightest yellow I could find. The Rustoleum paints go on SO much better than the stupid New Krylons do... and they have the old style 'cheapy' nozzles, which are infinitely better than the new fancy nozzle on the Krylon.

Here's the pics...

More to come... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-20-2009, 11:59 PM
Next up, I continued working on the orbiter. I sanded the leading edges of the wings to the shape described in the instructions, basically rounding off the top edge to the bottom edge to gain lift. I finished building up the rear propulsion section and the payload bay section, and glued them both to the wings as per the instructions. I cut the body flap out, cut one of the launch lugs in the kit into a 1/4 inch piece and halved the rest, and glued the two halves onto the body flap, and glued one side of the flap deployment elastic onto one corner of the rearmost flap on one corner. The 1/4 inch piece of lug gets glued to the wing centerline near the front of the orbiter. After all that had set up, I glued on the Tyvec paper included in the kit for the body flap hinge, with white glue. I hardened the wings with CA and then sanded them lightly to remove the 'grit' that the CA inevitably raises. Once that was done, I went ahead and glued on the forward crew cabin as per the instructions, and cut a small balsa piece to fill the small gap between the cabin and front end of the wing plate. I then moved on to the rear, and glued on the rudder, and trimmed and glued on the engine bells, after having painted them gunmetal gray and letting them dry. I glued on the other half the Tyvec paper hinge for the body flap to the main wing, leaving a small gap between them so the body flap can fully raise at deployment. I used my steel ruler and some clothespins to hold everything pressed tightly together while the glue dried, with a piece of wax paper in between to keep the ruler clean. After that was all dry, I then deployed the body flap full up, and carefully pulled the elastic flap deployer over the hook on the rear bulkhead, and keeping it taut, wrapped it over the opposing body flap corner and secured it with a clothespin, and rubbed a big drop of Titebond II into it and onto the corner of the body flap to glue it in place. After this dried, I went over it again with a smaller drop of glue, let that dry, and cut the remaining cord off.

I then carefully cut the belly wrap, which is an ingeniously resized photo of the actual shuttle re-entry tiles. Using the body flap template, I carefully cut the body flap part of the wrap off the back of the orbiter belly wrap so it can be glued seperately to the body flap. Don't glue it up as one piece or the body flap will be unable to deploy at tank sep and the orbiter will crash. I then carefully fitted the front portion to the orbiter belly, and satisfied with the fit, was ready to glue it on. I started thinking of how to mark the wrap so I could cut a small square hole in it for the front orbiter attachment lug, which was already glued onto the belly of the orbiter. I put a small drop of Titebond II on the lug, then carefully aligned the back of the wrap with the edges, and worked my way forward, preventing the underside of the wrap from touching the glue drop until I was satisfied everything was properly aligned. Let the wrap touch the glue, then lift it straight up, and lay it on the work mat, and cut 1/4 inch square out around the glue drop. Wipe what's left off the lug, and it's clean as a whistle. Works like a champ! After carefully cutting the hole for the lug, and checking the size and alignment, I then glued the belly wrap down with a good smear of white glue across the underside of the wings and belly.

The body flap tile wrap is a bit more challenging, since you have TWO alignment lugs to work around, but the same principle applies. You don't have to use a glue spot to mark it, just line it up, mark the centers with a pencil, and cut the notches for the lugs, since they go all the way to the front of the body flap anyway. Once you've notched for the mounting lugs, I made a small slit on either side of the rear part of the body flap, so those corners can go over the elastic glued on the rear corners of the flap, and the rest of the wrap can lay flat, and not interfere with the mounting lugs, since the ET rear tank mounting dowels have to be able to slide out of those lugs umimpeded at orbiter deploy. Glue the wrap on with a light coat of white glue, and it's a good idea to burnish it down, especially in the area immediately behind the orbiter mounting lugs, to make SURE it's all flat and won't interfere with deployment.

Here's some pics... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-21-2009, 12:02 AM
Next I started painting the ET. After building up an old spare curtain rod with some masking tape and installed an old motor case on it, (man I hope the boss doesn't find out about that one!) I installed the ET onto the motor case and moved it outside for painting.

I decided to go the NEW Krylon route, just to see how it looks with the new stuff. I found out something interesting after I got started. Look back at that photo of the REAL ET being moved out from Michoud to the barge for shipment to KSC (or maybe they're trucking it off the barge at KSC to the VAB) and you'll see how 'yellow' it looks. Looking at the photo mjennings posted later on showing the foam with the hail dings patched and you can see the thing is actually a lot lighter than we typically paint it. I think it's a perception thing-- big stuff usually LOOKS darker than it really is, especially when sandwiched between two 12 foot white SRB's and with a huge white top orbiter hung off it. Long story short, I started off with the Bauhaus Gold in NEW Krylon, painted the ET with 2 or 3 light coats for a base, and looking at the color decided that it's ALMOST A PERFECT MATCH with the 'aged' Hot Stuff foam sample I had on the dryer by the back door. I even took a photo with the foam sample to make my point. Basically, if you want an EASY paint job that is an EXCELLENT MATCH for the ET, just get a can of NEW Krylon BAUHAUS GOLD and give it a few coats and call it a day.

Here's some pics... note the foam sample color match... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-21-2009, 12:03 AM
Of course, me being a bit of an experimenter, decided to go ahead and do the full 'Zooch method' with the New Krylon just to see how it turned out. First, another coat of Bauhaus Gold since it was still kinda translucent after only a couple coats...

My daylight was fading, so I took two pics, the first without a flash, and the second one with. I kept the CFL porch light on while I was working and taking pics.

Here's the pics... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-21-2009, 12:04 AM
Next was a mist coat of Pumpkin Orange. "Mist coats" are kind of a misnomer with the New Krylon, as the nozzle tends to cropdust the paint on, so you have to 'whip' the can past the model as you paint; move MUCH faster than you are used to moving the can when using 'regular' (IE GOOD) spray paint...

Here's the pics... first with no flash, then with the flash. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-21-2009, 12:05 AM
Then we put on a mist coat of Ruddy Brown Primer in the NEW Krylon...

Remember to paint like Speedy Gonzales!!!

Pic one no flash, pic two flash on. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-21-2009, 12:07 AM
Finally, I went over it again with a light mist coat of Bauhaus Gold again, just to lighten the whole thing up. It takes on the Orange and Brown though, to give it a little 'character'. We'll see how it looks tomorrow in daylight.

I forgot to mention... I also masked the orbiter mounting dowels as the instructions suggest, to prevent paint from causing the orbiter to 'bind up' at deployment.

First the no flash pic then the flash pic. OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-25-2009, 10:16 PM
Ok, finally got back to work on the shuttle and finished her up! Lemme see where did I leave off... I think I was painting the ET.

It ended up looking a little 'muddy' in daylight, as the orange and brown just seemed to 'wash out' the yellow and just didn't look right to me, so I just went over it again with another couple light coats of "Bauhaus Gold" in New Krylon-- I'll let yall judge how it looks for yourselves...

I cut 3/16 inch strips of masking tape and actually masked over the SRB lines before I painted the tank, so that I could preserve the lines and keep the paint out of the way for better glue adhesion. After giving the tank about a day to dry after it's minor recoats, I removed all the masking, including off the orbiter mounting dowels. I dry fitted the SRB's to the ET to get the alignment right, and then sanded the glassine off the tube where the SRB's would go, and gave them and the ET a light coat of glue for double-glue joints. After the first coats pretty well dried, but still SLIGHTLY tacky, I put down another coat of glue and popped them together. I was having a bit of trouble aligning the SRB's to the tank, since the lines are hidden once you get the SRB in place, and so I just laid it flat on my work mat and rolled it over until the ET and SRB both touched the work mat, held it abit, and then picked it up and 'rolled' the SRB a bit to make sure it's seam was centered against the tank. I then secured it and let it dry overnight. The next day I did the other SRB the same way.

I finished up the orbiter with it's engine bells and painted the top of the wing white testor's enamel, and after that dried, hand painted the leading edge RCC panels in gunmetal gray. After those dried, I then painted the wing roots at the front black to match the tiles, and the black lines across the rear of the wings at the elevon attach point.

I also ran off a copy of Foose's shuttle wraps for Columbia on printer paper, and carefully cut out the NASA meatball and the flag and "COLUMBIA" name and daubed a bit of white glue on the back and glued them on the wings...

One thing I noticed is, on the right side of the orbiter, the flag is backwards That's actually kind of funny to me, anyway...

I also painted the rear elevator to look a bit more 'realistic' with the black dividing lines between the inner elevons and outer elevons.

Once the orbiter was done, I went ahead and cut the dowels for the 'SRB struts' which the real shuttle doesn't have (on the front anyway) but which help prevent the SRB's from ripping off on the model on landing. I found it MUCH easier to just use the razor saw to gently cut the dowels off at an angle, give it a half rotation, and cut it again at an angle 1/4 inch long, rather than trying to sand in the angles. They turned out pretty well, though I did install them at a slight 'outward' angle for perhaps a bit more strength than simply being 'flat' like Titan 3 struts.

I filleted the SRB's with white glue on both sides, and then glued the struts in place with white glue. I assembled the trash bag parachute while watching TV the other night, so we'll call her complete.

Here's some pics... OL JR

luke strawwalker
03-25-2009, 10:19 PM
All I really have left to do is trim the glide on the orbiter... but the cows have clipped everything down about an inch tall, so I have no 'recovery area' to speak of to do the trim tests... have to take it someplace nearby with grass...

I weighed the stack and the orbiter... the shuttle in ready to fly configuration, without engine, weighs in at 100 grams. The Orbiter weighs in at 16 grams. The orbiter balance point is 3 5/8 inch from the nose tip, about where the wings start to widen out, about 1/8 inch behind the first RCC panel. The entire stack CG without engine is about 4 1/2 inches from the ET nosecone tip. That moves it back 1/4 inch from the balance point of the ET/SRB's without the orbiter attached. These points are balanced WITH the parachute in the front of the ET, but without wadding and engine installed.

None of these balance points are mentioned in the instructions-- I just give them here for convenience, and perhaps maybe some input from Dr. Zooch if he would like to comment Perhaps Foose would check back in and give me a rough number of turns on the glide trim screw for a good 'starting point' for trimming the glider-- I noticed in his pics he posted of his gliders that the trim screw was run down pretty far-- not a whole lot of deflection was necessary.

Here's the money shots... This has been a fun build, and I've stretched my meager skills quite a bit. I've made a few mistakes, but I've learned from them, and I think I could do a MUCH better job if I were to do it again. I just might try it sometime, and I DEFINITELY learned a few things I can apply to other builds. If you have one of these, just GO FOR IT! If I can do it, anybody can if they take their time and try. If you don't have one of these, you owe it to yourself to get one. It'll teach you a lot and you'll have fun at the same time. Enjoy! OL JR

pantherjon
03-26-2009, 06:35 AM
Very nice! I have one of those in my build pile! Will get to 'one of these days':chuckle:

That ET turned out looking great! Nice job!

luke strawwalker
03-26-2009, 11:29 AM
Thanks... now I gotta see how she FLIES... OL JR :)

Jeff Walther
03-27-2009, 03:50 PM
Thanks... now I gotta see how she FLIES... OL JR :)

I'm looking forward to the pictures, if you take some. It looks great on the ground. Thank you for taking the time to document your build process.

luke strawwalker
03-27-2009, 08:43 PM
I'm looking forward to the pictures, if you take some. It looks great on the ground. Thank you for taking the time to document your build process.

Oh, no prob... I really love the doc's kits... they're like the ones I WANTED to buy years ago but couldn't afford to and found to be sadly missing when I got back into rocketry. When I found the doc's stuff and checked it out, I was hooked.

I'll be sure and post it here, on TRF, and RP as I have with the rest of the build thread when I get her in the air. I like crossposting because I get a wider variety of responses, as some folks favor certain boards and dislike or don't participate in others for whatever reason...

Thanks for looking! OL JR :)

luke strawwalker
04-23-2009, 04:08 PM
It's been too windy and wet to fly (not complaining about the wet part, we've been in a KILLER drought up til last Saturday then get nearly 1/4 of a year's worth of rain in one afternoon-- go figure... ) so I've been working on something shuttle-related...

I've got the major components coming along nicely but haven't assembled them yet, and can't until I get a few things for it... Hope to at least "mock it up" and take a few pics and get them on here, even if I don't have everything I need yet to completely finish it... until then, here are a few 'teaser shots'...

Later! OL JR

Jeff Walther
04-23-2009, 05:01 PM
so I've been working on something shuttle-related...

I've got the major components coming along nicely but haven't assembled them yet, and can't until I get a few things for it... Hope to at least "mock it up" and take a few pics and get them on here, even if I don't have everything I need yet to completely finish it... until then, here are a few 'teaser shots'...

So you've built your own (real) space shuttle and launch system inside a dormant volcano lair?

luke strawwalker
04-23-2009, 05:53 PM
So you've built your own (real) space shuttle and launch system inside a dormant volcano lair?

Close... wrong movie but close... Dormant volcano was You Only Live Twice... LOL:) ;)

If I were THAT good I'd just build me a Dr. Holly Goodhead and call it a day... LOL:)

OL JR :)

luke strawwalker
04-24-2009, 07:55 PM
Here's some super spycam pics I smuggled out of Drax Industries of the new Moonraker. Still a work in progress as you can see, but it's starting to come together. Hope mine doesn't develop a fault during assembly... ;)

My munificence is boundless.... bwahahahahaahhha.... :D

More later! OL JR :)

snaquin
04-24-2009, 11:16 PM
Here's some super spycam pics I smuggled out of Drax Industries of the new Moonraker. Still a work in progress as you can see, but it's starting to come together. Hope mine doesn't develop a fault during assembly... ;)

My munificence is boundless.... bwahahahahaahhha.... :D

More later! OL JR :)

Wow ..... that's really cool!

.

luke strawwalker
04-24-2009, 11:48 PM
Thank you... thank you very much...

What'd be amazing is if I could conjure Dr. Holly Goodhead out of some spare balsa and cardstock... LOL Oh well I can dream... :D

Got the OMS pods on tonight-- still working on the cabin. Also got the body flap glued on.

Hey Doc, where'd you get those teeny tiny nylon screws?? They're 4-56 right?? I got some today at the hardware store but they're too big...

Ok, gotta hit the sack-- Corrinne Dufour wants me to come look at something in her bedroom... :eek: Later! OL JR :)

luke strawwalker
07-13-2009, 04:33 PM
Well, I finally got a chance to fly my Dr. Zooch space shuttle. I was out of town for the last club launch and busy with end of school stuff before that.

Well, the club launch was winding down after launching the Saturn V's for the Apollo 11 anniversary, and while another couple rockets went up I prepped my Zooch Shuttle. I loaded the trash bag chute on top of the wadding and popped in an Estes C6-3 and installed the flamefins and orbiter and trekked out to Pad 34Z (Z for Zooch) and installed the clips, and off she went. The wind had picked up to about the highest it had been all day, and became a bit gusty as a thunderstorm rolled across the southern horizon. Since the guys were packing in the equipment I went on and sent her upstairs. She rolled as she lifted off, made a lazy arc to the south (sneaky polar shuttle launches!) and coasted to apogee and spilled the chute and jettisoned the orbiter right on schedule. The orbiter wavered a bit in the wind, and started a fast, tight spiralling glide, and after a couple revolutions steepened her glide path and was hit by a gust, tumbled, righted herself, started gliding again, made another revolution and was hit by another gust, tumbled, and couldn't find "UP" again before touching down undamaged in the tumble. The stack touched down about 50 feet away undamaged.

I can report that the eggcrate foam ET tank bottom dome that I installed around the motor was absolutely undamaged by any heat or plume recirculation of the rocket exhaust. There was some grunge on the flame fins spit by the motor, but the foam egg cup over the motor mount, which some doubted could handle the heat or would melt from engine exhaust backflow, was completely clean and in good shape.

Hopefully I can get her trimmed for a better glide and have a little smoother air for her next launch.

Later! OL JR :)