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  #41  
Old 02-06-2015, 06:15 PM
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Ironnerd Ironnerd is offline
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I assume that ISIS does not have the right to commit mass murder, take the territory of sovereign nations, and subjugate the inhabitants of those lands. I assume that some force (economic, moral, military, or other) must compel them to end their monstrous activities, as they show no inclination to reign themselves in. I said only that we went to war in the gulf twice for oil and to establish a stable democracy in the region. I never said it was the right thing to do, I just said it happened.

In this instance both Iraq and Jordan (both U.S. Allies) have requested our help in combating ISIS. We have performed limited (nearly pointless) air strikes in Iraq, and refused aid to Jordan. It's not butting in if they ask for your help, it's called "Helping". And if you work together with other nations against a common enemy, you are building stronger alliances and Forming Coalitions. Conveniently enough, it could point out that it was the previous administration that caused the problem and the current one that is helping to address it at the request of regional powers. Making our allies go it alone now is damaging to any cause we may have in the region.

So surely "someone" should do "something" about ISIS. To get back on topic, King Abdullah is that "someone" and he is doing "something".
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Last edited by Ironnerd : 02-06-2015 at 06:31 PM.
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  #42  
Old 02-06-2015, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironnerd
I assume that ISIS does not have the right to commit mass murder, take the territory of sovereign nations, and subjugate the inhabitants of those lands. I assume that some force (economic, moral, military, or other) must compel them to end their monstrous activities, as they show no inclination to reign themselves in. I said only that we went to war in the gulf twice for oil and to establish a stable democracy in the region. I never said it was the right thing to do, I just said it happened.

In this instance both Iraq and Jordan (both U.S. Allies) have requested our help in combating ISIS. We have performed limited (nearly pointless) air strikes in Iraq, and refused aid to Jordan. It's not butting in if they ask for your help, it's called "Helping". And if you work together with other nations against a common enemy, you are building stronger alliances and Forming Coalitions. Conveniently enough, it could point out that it was the previous administration that caused the problem and the current one that is helping to address it at the request of regional powers. Making our allies go it alone now is damaging to any cause we may have in the region.

So surely "someone" should do "something" about ISIS. To get back on topic, King Abdullah is that "someone" and he is doing "something".



Yes, and we should be supporting Jordan in that effort because it is in the national interests of the United States to do so. Doing nothing is not a viable option because the knuckleheads who populate that region of the planet have demonstrated the inability to police themselves without a ruthless dictator at the helm.

Fifteen of the nineteen 9-11 highjackers were from Saudi Arabia and they were allowed into the United States on student visas even after bin Laden's famous fatwa. So what was our response? Invade Iraq to depose Saddam Hussein! Why? Because in the first Gulf War, Saddam had launched scud missiles into Israel and Israel had (and has) nukes.

Here is more required reading: http://www.ipsnews.net/2004/03/iraq...l-bush-adviser/ You can't make this stuff up.
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  #43  
Old 02-09-2015, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by tmacklin
Yes, and we should be supporting Jordan in that effort because it is in the national interests of the United States to do so. Doing nothing is not a viable option because the knuckleheads who populate that region of the planet have demonstrated the inability to police themselves without a ruthless dictator at the helm.

Fifteen of the nineteen 9-11 highjackers were from Saudi Arabia and they were allowed into the United States on student visas even after bin Laden's famous fatwa. So what was our response? Invade Iraq to depose Saddam Hussein! Why? Because in the first Gulf War, Saddam had launched scud missiles into Israel and Israel had (and has) nukes.

Here is more required reading: http://www.ipsnews.net/2004/03/iraq...l-bush-adviser/ You can't make this stuff up.


Bush II's entire presidency was dedicated to "fixing" the stuff that he considered mistakes or unfinished by his old man, Bush I...

Hence "Gulf War II" to remove Saddam, where the old man left him in power at the end of Gulf War I... (and rightfully so, considering the complete BASKET CASE we've made out of the country since we "liberated" it...)

Also, and I pointed this out on the NSF forums and was basically called a "nutter" for suggesting it, but Bush I rolled out the "Space Exploration Initiative" (SEI) on the 20th anniversary of the Apollo 11 landing, on the steps of the Smithsonian in 1989... It was to be a "Moon, Mars, and Beyond" space program to define NASA's role for the next century. It turned out to be an unmitigated disaster, abandoned by the White House after repeated calls on Bush I appointee of his pal Richard "Dick" Truly to the role, who turned it into a massive "everything including the kitchen sink" program that became SO unaffordable it was laughed out of the halls of Congress, called by the derisive nickname "Battlestar Galactica" and died for lack of funding.

Bush II trotted out his own ALMOST WORD FOR WORD RETREAD of this program after the shuttle Columbia disaster, calling for his own "Moon, Mars, and Beyond" program called the "Vision for Space Exploration" (VSE). After turning the effort over to his pal Mike Griffin, who set about to create the largest, most expensive rocket ever conceived, and a littler rocket to carry crews alongside, which turned into an expensive technical nightmare, the entire program died of lack of funding and was canceled... Just as I said it would several years before it happened...

Later! OL JR
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  #44  
Old 02-10-2015, 07:22 PM
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The inbred A-wholes who call themselves ISIS murdered another innocent person in Syria, this time a 26 year old American, Kayla Mueller. Of course these inbred A-wholes are blaming the airstrikes by coalition forces so once again it is our fault.

Get our people out and then nuke these Bass Turds off the face of the Earth!
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  #45  
Old 02-10-2015, 08:14 PM
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Absolutely second what tmacklin just said.
NUKE them out of existence.
Most of the middle east has proven for centuries that they are incapable of governing themselves in a civil manner without attacking others under the guise of some A$ININE religion directive.
ANNIHILATE 'em all. NOT JOKING.
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  #46  
Old 02-10-2015, 08:35 PM
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Nukes are a bit over the top, but then 20 sorties a day is rather underwhelming.

Any organization as large as ISIS has bases, depots, etc... Go after those first. Don't capture them, just destroy them.

ISIS will surely take refuge among the civilians they have conquered. There will, therefore, be civilian casualties, which will create hatred among the survivors towards the US (because we are the leaders of this circus - even when we're not).

So, beyond blowing up ammo dumps and truck lots, we'll have to fight dirty. Sell them AK-47's with stocks filled with C4 and remote detonators through shadow merchants. Sell them ammunition with half-loads of powder. LAWS that explode in the tubes. Things that really only hurt those doing bad things, and cause them to lose trust in their weapons.

We should also make available to them stashes of inert C4 replicant. Put it in something that looks like a legitimate ammo dump or supply truck/convoy. Let them capture broken equipment (like that plumbers truck that showed up in Syria).

Put "Lo-Jacks" on everything so we can find them.

In short, play dirty, mess up their fun and games, and demoralize and kill them with a minimum of civilian casualties.
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  #47  
Old 02-10-2015, 10:36 PM
mikemech mikemech is offline
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Islam extremists hate the west because our system works and their's doesn't.
These are people (I use the term loosely) who torture, enslave and murder anyone they don't approve of. Does this sound familiar to anyone?
Whatever we do, the deaths are always our fault. A war is won by whoever is willing to spill the most blood. These murderers are way ahead of us.
Air strikes are not over the top. Boots on the ground are no longer over the top. Tactical nukes are no longer over the top.
I see three choices: we can kill them there now, with much bloodshed; we can kill them here later with much more bloodshed; we can die.
Form a coalition, invade, occupy for at least two generations. We already tried the quickie.
Good ideas, Ironnerd. Don't forget to follow the money. Any who supply or aid them are equally guilty.
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  #48  
Old 02-10-2015, 11:59 PM
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The ONLY way the west will win this is to either Conquer and Subjugate or total ANNIHILATION with Nukes.
Either way does not bother me at all; those middle eastern dirtbags are nothing but a destabilization force the world does NOT need.
We did not fuss around worrying about civilian casualties when crushing the Nazis and we should not with these walking bags of fecal matter either.
Time to take the gloves off and take care of business.
The only thing these POS dirtbags understand is violence. Respond in a more ruthless and violent manner that is beyond their comprehension. Break their will. Bury their dead with a mixture of Pig Guts as an insult to them.
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When in doubt, WHACK the GAS and DITCH the brake !!!

Yes, there is such a thing as NORMAL
, if you have to ask what is "NORMAL" , you probably aren't !

Failure may not be an OPTION, but it is ALWAYS a POSSIBILITY.
ALL systems are GO for MAYHEM, CHAOS, and HAVOC !
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  #49  
Old 02-11-2015, 01:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
The ONLY way the west will win this is to either Conquer and Subjugate or total ANNIHILATION with Nukes.
Either way does not bother me at all; those middle eastern dirtbags are nothing but a destabilization force the world does NOT need.
We did not fuss around worrying about civilian casualties when crushing the Nazis and we should not with these walking bags of fecal matter either.
Time to take the gloves off and take care of business.
The only thing these POS dirtbags understand is violence. Respond in a more ruthless and violent manner that is beyond their comprehension. Break their will. Bury their dead with a mixture of Pig Guts as an insult to them.


Yep...

I was watching a WWII documentary once, and this chap from the RAF Bomber Command was telling it how it was... (IS)...

"We knew we were dropping bombs when only 1 in 10 hit within five miles of the target... but we'd decided that if we couldn't knock off "Jerry" in his factory, maybe we could knock him off in his bed... and if poor old Granny Schickelgruber across the way got it instead, well tough luck for her!"

We can do better than that now, but the point remains the same... While we fret and wring our hands over "collateral damage" and civilian casualties, it's a policy that we've reinforced through our own actions... the scumbags KNOW we'll fret over it and now DELIBERATELY put their HQ's, weapon stashes, and even missile launchers and stuff in schools, hospitals, apartment houses, etc right in the middle of as many "innocent civilians" as possible. Heck due to all the bad press, Israel is now mostly going along with this nonsense-- they were WARNING the civilians that attacks were coming so they could run away beforehand... of course the scumbags either wouldn't let them run away, keeping them there at gunpoint, or they were so "supportive" of the scumbag's aims that they agreed to stay as a human shield and take their chances... in the meantime, the scumbags moved anything of value out of the target area and relocated it to prevent its destruction.

This is 180 degrees from the message we should be sending... blow the ever-lovin' sh!t out of their stuff and if "poor old Granny Schicklegruber" gets it in the process, OH WELL... make it KNOWN and CLEARLY UNDERSTOOD that if you see the scumbags moving crap into your area, you better either 1) run like h3ll, or 2) get a 'citizens committee' to pop them in the head from windows or back alley doorways as they come into the neighborhood IF YOU WANT TO LIVE. No quarter will be asked OR GIVEN! We see 'em, we blow them up, PERIOD. No more hiding behind kindergartens and hospital wards...

It's kill or be killed, and the idiot talking heads on TV and PC nutjobs in power and intellectuals sitting in the halls of academia haven't figured that out yet... they still think they can "out TALK" these scumbags, as if they give a d@mn about anything or anybody...

WIPE THEM FROM THE FACE OF THE EARTH!

Later! OL JR
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  #50  
Old 02-11-2015, 06:03 AM
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To be clear; I don't think King Abdullah is going overboard. Unfortunately, an "overboard response" is what will be needed to get rid of these ISIS pigs. It is my hope that nukes are not required, but I would not take them off the table. I don't really want to go the "Kill Everybody" route - I just wanna crush ISIS, Boko Haram, Al Quaeda, et al...

I also believe they will come here (actually, I am certain that ISIS is already in the United States), and that they will try to get all Middle-Eastern on us. What they may not recognize is that we're not Syria, Iraq, or even Israel. We have Texans, and we will use them if provoked.
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