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  #11  
Old 02-23-2018, 07:04 PM
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The new Quest composite A and B motors are available on the Quest site in 2-paks and 25-paks.

I don't care if comparing discounted Estes motors to Quest composites is "fair" or not...all that matters to me is ACTUAL cost per n-sec. $4.50 for a 5n-sec B plus shipping is outrageous.
The C and D if close to that price may be worthwhile due to no other motors available currently like this C8 and D12 in that size.
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  #12  
Old 02-23-2018, 07:13 PM
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With the D12 being only 2ns more than the C, will it be like the old D21/E24 thing, where eventually no one bought the E24 because it wasn't that much more powerful than the D21 ?
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  #13  
Old 02-23-2018, 07:55 PM
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The Quest D12 only has a peak thrust of 3.5 lbs according to what Quest has posted.
The Estes C11 has a peak thrust of 4.88 lbs based on NAR testing.

The Quest motor has 3 n/s more total impulse because the initial spike doesn't drop off much, which is typical of a bates grain with the right dimensions. The Estes motor drops to about 2.5 lbs after the peak. It will be interesting to compare the two's ability to lift and keep a heavy rocket stable for nice low demo flights in tight areas.
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  #14  
Old 02-23-2018, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Royatl
With the D12 being only 2ns more than the C, will it be like the old D21/E24 thing, where eventually no one bought the E24 because it wasn't that much more powerful than the D21 ?

The Estes C6 and C11 are only 9 n/s, which will help the D12 out a little, assuming the numbers aren't embellished. However, if it isn't competitive in price, it will be a niche motor. Folks needing a better performing 18mm C will buy it for their 18mm Mars Landers and maybe a few other heavy birds, but I doubt many folks will use it in a rocket that will take a 24mm C11.
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  #15  
Old 02-23-2018, 10:25 PM
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The flyer that Gary is handing out says the As and Bs can be preordered starting 11:59 PM MST on March 2nd. He said at the vendor forum that they will start to ship in April.

In a conversation I had with him earlier today I got the impression that the C8 and D12 are somewhat further out and I noted to him that they both would fill a need for something that is currently not available at all (I was thinking Estes C5-3s as I said this).

He said in at the vendor forum that these were the hardest R&D project he’s had at Aerotech and that cost of manufacturing, so that they can be sold with “standard discounts” was a big factor. So that at least suggests that, for example, Hobbylinc could sell them for less than the SRP of $8 or two As and $9 for two Bs. But first they have to get out there at all.....

There was no mention of any shipments to eRockets - either by Gary or by Randy Boadway. I suppose I can ask Randy tomorrow if he expects any soon. But based on what’s on the flyer, Randy will have to order them starting on 3/2 as well.
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  #16  
Old 02-24-2018, 07:18 AM
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I bought a bunch of mini-composites, I believe Apogee, at a NARAM once. I think I bought about half of what he had. Good little motors. They do things that cannot be replaced at any price.

18mm D's are miraculous for weenie rockets.

Just Jerry

http://v-serv.com/usr/motors/e10a.html
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  #17  
Old 02-24-2018, 02:03 PM
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I would guess the vendors are getting their sites ready for the new motors. When they are in stock their ready to sell them.
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  #18  
Old 02-25-2018, 09:31 AM
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Jerry Irvine Jerry Irvine is offline
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Since Quest and Aerotech are believers in motor clips, they could make 3 lengths with current clips. 1.75", 2.75", 3.75". Furthermore they could make a version even longer that simply sticks out the back a bit and, gag, use the U.S. Rockets motor retention method for longer motors.

All our 18mm kits and conversions are compatible with any length motor.

I once bought a batch of 24mm E motors from Aerotech that didn't fit in standard motor tubes (BT-50, BT-9).

I am concerned we may be seeing that again with the Q-Jet brand motors.

From BMS I clipped the BT-20 clone tube dimensions.

T20-34 .736x.710x.013x34 Estes 18mm

0.710" ID

From the published spec sheet the new motors are 0.703" (presumably inclusive of the label), or total clearance of 0.007". This could be an issue in a well used tube or a humid launch site. Estes motors because they are pressed are thicker at the nozzle end than the ejection end and that small taper makes insertion easy. Maybe version 2 will have a slight bevel at the ejection end of the case.

From the document in post #15. News release at NARCON.

A couple of the cool things about the motors is they seem to be glue free (except label) and use the same cases for all SKU's.

I wonder if the nozzles are molded in as a 2nd op? Quest motor machine for new motor assembly?

Jerry
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Last edited by Jerry Irvine : 02-25-2018 at 12:41 PM.
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  #19  
Old 02-26-2018, 11:28 AM
astronwolf astronwolf is offline
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I have a pack of B4-6 motors that I won as a door prize at NARCON.

These are standard sized 18x70mm motors.

The cases are not cardboard, so they aren't going to swell.

They are composite motors, so they aren't "pressed" like blackpowder motors. They are not going to be bulged from compressing the propellant.

The aft end appears to have a modular delay train/ejection charge thingee glued in.

The nozzles appear to be some sort of clay. I was told the nozzle throat is 0.09-inches in the B4 motors. I did compare a fired case with a new case to check how much nozzle erosion occurred, but I did not have a way to measure it. Erosion looked like "a little bit." This is a much wider throat than the notorious old Apogee B7 motors. I asked Gary how he was able to increase the size of the nozzle throat, and he told me that it is a combination of using a hot, new composite propellant and grain geometry. He said that developing and testing these motors was a very time consuming and difficult project.

Can't wait to fly them.
-W
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  #20  
Old 02-26-2018, 11:47 AM
L3Excalibur L3Excalibur is offline
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Default Quest composite motor availability

Gary talked a lot about the new composite motors at NARCON this past weekend. He says on-line ordering will begin in early March deliveries will start for the A/B motors in April. The C/D motors will follow in a couple of months, he said. He came to NARCON with a few packs to give away. Nice Enerjet throw-back label scheme.

Gary also said all of the motors are full impulse when tested at Aerotech, at 5000 ft MSL. When Tripoli/NAR test them near sea level they are a little less. I believe he said the motors are currently TRA certified but that he has sent the samples for testing to NAR as well.

Buzz McD.
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