Hello:

I would like to introduce myself and ask a little advice. I was into Estes rockets as a kid (early 70's) and built several kits- including the original Alpha, Interceptor (that was COOL), Sandhawk, a few Goonybirds and several Centuri kits as well.

Well, I'm back courtesy of my 8 and 10 year olds - they are rabid rocket fans - we have recently built Big Bertha, CD Gemini, Cosmos Mariner, Canadian Arrow, and have a Super Bertha on the plate. Next as well will be a SwingWing transport. It's fun to be back. The kids are onto the demo version of Rocksim as well and are designing and test flying like crazy..my times have changed. My 10 year old is digesting the Model Rocket Handbook whish we recently purchased in the US.

Here is a two general questions (of many hopefully) that I would like advice on. We are huge fans of V2 rockets and recently we won an older Maxi V2 kit on ebay. After seeing some posts here I'd like some advice on building it as strong as possible. Any advice on strengthening plastic fins, inner support rings, baffling, etc? I am wondering if we perhaps would have looked around for a different kit from one of the other companies - rather than this V2 (although we bought it now!). Any thoughts or feedback appreciated.

Secondly – and I am completely new to the newer engines this – what are the benefits of going to a different engine than the Estes D or E? Would a Aerotech RMS ( say a 24) fit in the V2? If so, what modification would be required? What are the pluses/minuses of RMS engines vs. Estes engines? Any thoughts appreciated!

Thank you – this post is a bit long. My apologies.

Randy

I've got some bad news for you, Randy. You're obviously one of us. Your pocket protector is in the mail.
Uh, but I don't have any answers for you. I'm kind of useless that way.

__________________
Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I miss being SAM 0058

Build floor: Centuri Mini Dactyl Estes - Low Boom SST Semroc - Marauder, Shrike, SST Shuttle

In paint: Canaroc Starfighter Scorpion Estes F-22 Air Superiority Fighter, Multi-Roc, Solar Sailer II Semroc Cyber III

Ready to fly: Estes - Solar Sailer II Semroc - Earmark, Groonie Der V 1/2

The Maxi V-2 has plastic fins? Who would have thought. I guess I should open mine a take a gander.......Yeah, I'm just like Bill.....

Okay, mine has them plastic things too . I've heard of people using balsa to beef-up plastic fins on the Honest John and the latest incantation of the Saturn V. They cut the balsa and glue it between the two plastic halves of the fins. Of course, some shaping of the balsa may be required to achieve a good fit . Of course, you could always use the plastic ones as a guide to making balsa or plywood fins. But looking at the detail on them in the kit, I think I would go with the balsa between the halves .

As for engines....Sometimes the engines specified by Estes doesn't really work for the rocket. By that I mean, the completed rocket is sometimes heavier than the rocket Estes kitted. And then, of course, the recommended engine just doesn't get the rocket either a) going fast enough for a stable flight after leaving the launch rod or b) doesn't get it high enough for the parachute to deploy before the rocket plunges into the ground, breaking it into so many pieces that you can't believe you spent so many hours working on .....Oh, I digress.....been there, done that . So the RMS motors, and for that matter, single use Aerotech motors, give you an option of engine selection. But, a word of caution. Check the thrust curves and recommended max lift off weights for the motor. An E motor doesn't nessisarily(sp?) mean better performance than a D, nor F better than E. And you don't want a motor that accelerates so quickly that it rips your fins off. 24mm reloads will fit Estes D/E motor mounts (same size as a D engine). However, they usually have more kick on the ejection charge than the Estes motors so make sure you have an adequate shock cord....maybe twice the length of the stock shock cord. Also, you may want to consider going with a thicker walled stuffer tube. The standard BT-50 tube will burn through on you after a few flights, regardless of motor manufacturer. Some vendors offer a foiled lined tube to last longer.

Pros and cons? Well, the RMS system is high front end cost but the reloads are cheaper than buying single use (over the long run and assuming you don't lose your reload case). The reloads take longer to prep for launch but after you do it for a while, you get the knack. Wouldn't recommend letting little ones build the reloads unless you're there supervising but thats the same with single use motors anyway.

Good luck and keep checking your post. There's a lot of people out there who really know what they're talking about .


Don
NAR 53455

While this may not be specific to the V-2, I believe the HoJo uses the same kind of fins. You might want to give this site a check while you're at it.
http://www.ninfinger.org/~sven/rockets/hj.faq.html

__________________
Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I miss being SAM 0058

Build floor: Centuri Mini Dactyl Estes - Low Boom SST Semroc - Marauder, Shrike, SST Shuttle

In paint: Canaroc Starfighter Scorpion Estes F-22 Air Superiority Fighter, Multi-Roc, Solar Sailer II Semroc Cyber III

Ready to fly: Estes - Solar Sailer II Semroc - Earmark, Groonie Der V 1/2

Thank you for the replies. I'm proud to be a "geek" enjoying a great hobby with my boys.
Great way to teach them patience, hobby skills and math as well. My 8 year old is firmly convinced he will work for ESTES as a designer someday.

My boys have already bought a few ESTES starter kits to give as birthday gifts for their buds. Good way to start others off.

We''ll take all the information we can get. We like to have fun and learn at the same time. Seems that this hobby has grown a lot since 1971.

thanks again..I'm particularly interested in upgrading the Estes kits and fitting in the RMS motors. Adds yet another dimension to an already interesting hobby.

Randy

Randy,

From one geek to another, welcome!

Your 8 year old doesn't have to wait for "someday" to become a designer, maybe just a few years more of school. I would highly recommend drafting and archetecture classes at the HS level when the time comes. Of course, math and science classes are generally useful, too...

With parts supply houses like BMS and SEMROC available today, most of us who build models these days aren't "locked in" to just Estes as a source. We're also not locked in to the simple and (generally) uninteresting designs out of Estes, either. If you remember the old Centuri designs, SEMROC is reproducing many of those kits now, with improvements. Sunward has the old Canaroc designs that will just blow you away.

And (tooting my own horn just a bit), there is the BARCLONE collection of non-kitted designs which is hosted here on the Rocket Shoppe server. BARCLONE is a place where you can try out your hand at design and have that design posted for everyone to try out. It's like the "Open Source" version of model rocketry...

__________________
Craig McGraw

BARCLONE Rocketry -- http://barclone.rocketshoppe.com
BARCLONE Blogsite -- http://barclone.wordpress.com
BARCLONE Forum -- BARCLONE Forum

BARs helping BARs

SAM 0044
AMA 352635

Yeah, but you're still fun.

Cheers,

--Jay
(Humming "Back in Black" to himself whilst he sits at the computer wearing his suit jacket, slacks, and white shirt)

I was planning to get out and fly today, but I woke up so sore from working on the house yesterday that I can barely move. I'm trying to get moving, but it's like driving in mud.
Bill
(Humming the CBS Sports theme while sitting at the computer in his underwear and a pink Oxford. )

__________________
Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I miss being SAM 0058

Build floor: Centuri Mini Dactyl Estes - Low Boom SST Semroc - Marauder, Shrike, SST Shuttle

In paint: Canaroc Starfighter Scorpion Estes F-22 Air Superiority Fighter, Multi-Roc, Solar Sailer II Semroc Cyber III

Ready to fly: Estes - Solar Sailer II Semroc - Earmark, Groonie Der V 1/2

Oooh, that's a mental picture I did NOT need!

Later,
EV

Why do you think I wrote it?

__________________
Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I miss being SAM 0058

Build floor: Centuri Mini Dactyl Estes - Low Boom SST Semroc - Marauder, Shrike, SST Shuttle

In paint: Canaroc Starfighter Scorpion Estes F-22 Air Superiority Fighter, Multi-Roc, Solar Sailer II Semroc Cyber III

Ready to fly: Estes - Solar Sailer II Semroc - Earmark, Groonie Der V 1/2