Booster motors

[Rocket Doctor]

In another thread, the discussion about finding B6-0 boosters and other motors has appeared.

I'm getting curious and I know we have had this discussion about motors in the past, but, I would like to get another list going.

What are the top THREE mini boosters and regular booster motors that you would like to see again.

Now, only the top three, not a long list, only three.

[gpoehlein]

Hmm - not counting the boosters already out there:

A8-0
A10-0T
A3-0T

I'd ask for one more, but you said only three. :p

Greg

[Doug Sams]

What are the top THREE mini boosters and regular booster motors that you would like to see again.1. B14-0
2. 1/2Ax-0T
3. Ax-0T

(While an A8-0 would be nice, I'd rather have a 13mm A-booster. I can always fly a 13mm motor in an 18mm tube. Not so the other way around. I have a good stash of A10-0T's that will last me several years, so I'm not hurtin' for them, but in terms of what benefits the hobby, I see an Ax-0T as most useful.

In terms of new boosters, I want high thrust, fast burners - ie, the C, D, E and F-impulse equivalents of the B14-0.)

Doug

.

[STRMan]

1/2A6-0
A10-0T
A8-0

Due to the fact that launch areas are getting smaller due to development, small power boosters would probably be a big seller instead of having engine combinations that would almost insure a lost rocket. Also, staging down low where you can see it is so much more interesting than having staging way up and out of sight.

There are my top "realistic" 3, as I'm sure it would be a small matter to produce them. Of course, I would LOVE to see a B14-0, but it seems the core drilling process will prohibit this from ever happening again. I would also be inclined to mention the B8-0 in lieu of the A8-0, but I have never used a B8-0 as it came and left production before I became a BAR, thus my desire to see this engine is based simply on what others have said about it. A C11-0 would also be nice. I'm assuming we're talking Estes here, but I would also love to see a Quest A6-0 booster.

Also, If I ever got lucky enough to see a 1/2A6-0 again, it should be mated to a 1/2A6-4, another engine it would be simple to manufacture again.

[jflis]

Excluding current motors, my list would look like this:

A8-0
A3-0T
1/2A3-0T

jim

[Bob Kaplow]

Mini: A5-0S, A10-0T

Standard: B14-0!!!! 1/4A.8-0, A5-0

Yea, I REALLY liked those A5s, and the MPC A3s. The short delays were great for gliders, and the longer delays for Alt/SD and other minimum diameter models.

[Bob Kaplow]

Hmmm, do I hear an F100-0 anywhere?

[Mark II]

I could easily give you my top three in any of the standard motor diameters from 6mm to 29mm, including the obsolete ones, but since you just want a limited list, here are my top three 18mm booster motors:

A10-0 (a real one, not an A10-0T)
B14-0
C20-0

:D

Mark \\.

[barone]

Hmmm, do I hear an F100-0 anywhere?
Oh....just found mine. Will match it up to a D18 and see if I can hit mach with the FSI Dart.... :D

[Mark II]

I could also list three FSI motors that I would like to see brought back:

D20-0
E60-0
F100-0

I'll stop here, because you said that you didn't want a laundry list. This is a really tough question to answer, Doc, because, as you well know, we all want so many. We all have really great designs, and really great design ideas, that just don't work with the currently available motors on the market, yet which fall within the model rocket and large model rocket size and weight ranges. There are just so many desirable possibilities that are NOT being made now. But, of course, I realize that there is not enough room in the market for everything.

Mark \\.

[Rocket Doctor]

I really don't think that you will be seeing any B14's of anytype coming out of Estes. This was made very clear along time ago, unfortunately.

[Mark II]

I really don't think that you will be seeing any B14's of anytype coming out of Estes. This was made very clear along time ago, unfortunately.
True enough. But I thought that you were asking about what we would LIKE to see, vs. what we would EXPECT to ever see again.

Mark \\.

[CJU]

My booster wish list (limited to 3) would be:

A8-0
A10-0T
B8-0

[Shreadvector]

Oh....just found mine. Will match it up to a D18 and see if I can hit mach with the FSI Dart.... :D

You mis-spelled "D20". ;)

[Eagle3]

I really don't think that you will be seeing any B14's of anytype coming out of Estes. This was made very clear along time ago, unfortunately.

Your original post did not specify vendor. If you were to ask which mini boosters we'd like to see come from Estes I'd say that would be a worthless question to ask. It's not going to happen unless they come out with a kit that would use them.

You're probably right about B14's from any vendor considering how difficult they are to produce. :(

[snaquin]

In another thread, the discussion about finding B6-0 boosters and other motors has appeared.

I'm getting curious and I know we have had this discussion about motors in the past, but, I would like to get another list going.

What are the top THREE mini boosters and regular booster motors that you would like to see again.

Now, only the top three, not a long list, only three.

Rocketflite

F50-0
G160-0
H220-0

.

[STRMan]

We all know how long BP motors can last if taken care of. Estes should embark on one or two "limited edition" motor runs each year. Just pick one discontinued motor, make a limited run, and sell it at a premium price. Call me a fool, but I'd pay $12.00 or maybe even more for a 3 pack of A8-0's or 1/2A6-0's. I would probably stock up with a couple of dozen motors because I would know they wouldn't be available for a very long time.

It might even be better to just sell these booster motors in 24 packs to the general public. They could sell them to retailers in 24 packs and let the retailers break them out for 3 pack sales.

Just wishful thinking, I guess.

[Solomoriah]

I'd like to see:

A8-0
B8-0
A3-0T

[space_bus]

It's hard to narrow down to three, but I'd like to see:

1. 1/2A3-0T
2. B8-0
3. C5-0

Although I've never used either the B8-0 or C5-0, it seems like they would make excellent booster engines, even for a three stage rocket. If that is known to be wrong, then I'd substitute the C11-0 for the C5-0.

[Rocket Doctor]

Your original post did not specify vendor. If you were to ask which mini boosters we'd like to see come from Estes I'd say that would be a worthless question to ask. It's not going to happen unless they come out with a kit that would use them.

You're probably right about B14's from any vendor considering how difficult they are to produce. :(


Maybe if the list was rekindled, they would. I guess we can have a christmas wish list and hopefully, it will come true.

[ghrocketman]

Regular 18mm:
A8-0
B14-0 (if I can't have a drilled-core B14-0 for some mamby-pamby safety reason, I'd take the pressed-core B8-0)
D8-0 (recreation of the 13n-sec 18mm Cox D that was filled almost to the case top)

Mini 13mm
1/2A3-0T
A10-0T
B4-0M (the old long Centuri mini-motor)

[Solomoriah]

Ooh, yeah, let me change my vote. I want to drop the A8-0 in favor of that D8-0.

[Eagle3]

...

B4-0M (the old long Centuri mini-motor)

I loved the old B4. Those would be nice and a stout C or D18

[Shreadvector]

I loved the old B4. Those would be nice and a stout C or D18

Perhaps your Quest for a long mini B will soon be over?

http://www.made-in-china.com/china-products/productviewwhJEnGxromQO/Toy-Model-Rocket-Engine-A6-3-B6-4-C6-4-D5-0-.html

[ghrocketman]

That 13mm B looks promising.
That would be great as a booster in a fire-and-forget Estes Beta

[moonzero2]

A8-0
A10-0T
1/2A3-0T

[tbzep]

That 13mm B looks promising.
That would be great as a booster in a fire-and-forget Estes Beta

An Estes mini is 45mm long, and these Quest/China B2-3T's are 68mm, about the length of a standard motor. They would hang out the back of the booster a good 20mm. Nose weight would be mandatory, and it still might not be stable. Sounds like fun. :D

[ghrocketman]

Every now-'n-again a flight profile (tail-heavy) resembling a bottle rocket with the stick busticated-off is interesting. :p

[PaulK]

...What are the top THREE mini boosters and regular booster motors that you would like to see again...

It *is* tough to narrow down, and since you stipulated "mini" and "regular", I won't put an A5-0S in the list, though it would be otherwise:

1/2A3-0T
A3-0T
A8-0

[caheaton]

Chalk me up for the following:

A8-0
B8-0
C5-0

(all 18mm)

Craig

[Jeff Walther]

My top wish is for a 1/2A3-0T or maybe a 1/2A10-0T, although I don't think that was ever made before. As mentioned by others, because big fields are hard to find, but I still want to fly staged rockets.

The A8-0 is also appealing for the same reason.

Is the B6-0 discontinued? I've seen mention of this in passing in some threads, but have not found a thread dealing with it specifically. And one posting was about two years old, yet the B6-0 still seems to be available from vendors.

If you count my first paragraph as one wish, then my third wish would be to bring back any of the B14 engines. I loved those guys. They are just spectacular and no other engine (with which I am familiar) makes quite the same sound.

Finally, how dangerous would it be to drill/scrape out the ejection charge and smoke delay from a corresponding engine to make a booster engine? As I understand it, boosters are just regular engines with everything after the propellant omitted.

[Rocket Doctor]

My top wish is for a 1/2A3-0T or maybe a 1/2A10-0T, although I don't think that was ever made before. As mentioned by others, because big fields are hard to find, but I still want to fly staged rockets.

The A8-0 is also appealing for the same reason.

Is the B6-0 discontinued? I've seen mention of this in passing in some threads, but have not found a thread dealing with it specifically. And one posting was about two years old, yet the B6-0 still seems to be available from vendors.

If you count my first paragraph as one wish, then my third wish would be to bring back any of the B14 engines. I loved those guys. They are just spectacular and no other engine (with which I am familiar) makes quite the same sound.

Finally, how dangerous would it be to drill/scrape out the ejection charge and smoke delay from a corresponding engine to make a booster engine? As I understand it, boosters are just regular engines with everything after the propellant omitted.

First of all, WELCOME........

You can find B6-0's in the educator bulk pack of motors.

You will not see B14 being produced by Estes, this has been a topic of discussion for ever.

Don't alter any motors for whatever reason, we must be patient and see if any of the requested motrs show up antime in the future.

Follow the NAR safety code and keep the hobby's safety record intact for future generations, we didn't get to celebrate our 50th by not following the rules and regulations.

[DaveR]

Finally, how dangerous would it be to drill/scrape out the ejection charge and smoke delay from a corresponding engine to make a booster engine? As I understand it, boosters are just regular engines with everything after the propellant omitted.

No warranties expressed or implied, and as the good doc said it's definately a violation of the safety code:

http://forums.rocketshoppe.com/showthread.php?t=3590

[elbraz]

I've always wanted E9 booster motors, and the rocket fairy dropped one in my lap. I was breaking out E9 motors for a week-end launch, and ran across what was labeled an E9-4 in a package of E9-6's. When I looked the motor over, I noticed that there wasn't a clay cap, and the motor grain was visible. Is this a mislabeled booster that got out the door somehow? Probably just a Mabel glitch, but this is the first mis-labeled motor from estes that I've found.
-Braz

[Doug Sams]

Is this a mislabeled booster that got out the door somehow? Probably just a Mabel glitch, but this is the first mis-labeled motor from estes that I've found. Hi, Braz,

Could be a glitch, but they did make and distribute a handful of the E9-0's. So, instead of an unfinished E9-4 it might be a mis-labeled E9-0.

I can't recall where, but I know some folks got a few E9-0's. AFAIK, they never made it to the main distributor and retail channels, but, IIRC, some units were sent out as promotional items. (BTW, they did get the booster certified.)

Doug

.

[Mark II]

Estes B6-0 booster motors are not OOP, and they are widely available from online sources and brick-and-mortar hobby shops. There is no shortage of them, as far as I can tell. Sure, you can't get them at places like Wal-Mart or Michael's, but then, you never could. Also, if I'm not mistaken, Quest also still makes B6-0 motors, or at least still has them in stock.

Mark \\.

[Shreadvector]

Estes B6-0 booster motors are not OOP, and they are widely available from online sources and brick-and-mortar hobby shops. There is no shortage of them, as far as I can tell. Sure, you can't get them at places like Wal-Mart or Michael's, but then, you never could. Also, if I'm not mistaken, Quest also still makes B6-0 motors, or at least still has them in stock.

Mark \\. (file://\\.)

Estes B6-0 motor three packs are now being sold at Toys R Us to go with the new two stage rocket Launch Set.

Not every TRU has them yet, but as the Holidays approach, all that carry model rockets should get some.

I've been in 4 area TRU stores and most have the sets but none have motors, but they have motor shelf tags.

[Jeff Walther]

Estes B6-0 motor three packs are now being sold at Toys R Us to go with the new two stage rocket Launch Set.

The Toys R Us near me (Austin, TX, 360 & Lamar) had them a few weeks ago--which is why I've been puzzled by the posts I've seen in these forums suggesting that they were OOP. Plus, as mentioned by others, they are available in the bulk back with 12 B6-0 and 12 B6-6 from several mail order places.

[Doug Sams]

The Toys R Us near me (Austin, TX, 360 & Lamar) had them a few weeks ago--which is why I've been puzzled by the posts I've seen in these forums suggesting that they were OOP. Plus, as mentioned by others, they are available in the bulk back with 12 B6-0 and 12 B6-6 from several mail order places.Y'all keep talking about them and 'fore long I'll hafta put in another ACSupply order :)

I already have quite a stash, but here lately I've been burning them 3 at a time in my clustered boosters, and I get nervous if my stash gets below 30 motors :)

Doug

.

[ghrocketman]

The idiotic Toys-R-Us near me carries rocket kits, but NEVER motors.

[Solomoriah]

3 packs of Estes B6-0's have been OOP for a long time... up until just recently when they brought them back. As far as I know, only Toys 'R' Us has them right now.

[Shreadvector]

The idiotic Toys-R-Us near me carries rocket kits, but NEVER motors.

Talk to the manager. If they do not provide a satisfactory response (i.e. "they will be here in one week"), then call a national toll-free customer service number and report the poor customer service and ask for help with a successful resolution to your problem.

http://www.toysrus.com/helpdesk/contact_us.jsp

[ghrocketman]

Thanks for the idea Fred....I just may have to do that as it seems the only way to get new-production B6-0's that I have came across without buying the B6-0/B6-6 bulk-pakk is supposedly at TRU.
I know my two local hobby shops don't have them and I have not located a source on the internet yet either.

[Mark II]

I know my two local hobby shops don't have them and I have not located a source on the internet yet either.
Here are a few online sources:

http://www.discounthobbycenter.com/product/EST-001608

https://www.discountrocketry.com/estes-engines-p-167.html

http://www.launchpad2000.com/estes-1608.html

http://leadingedgerocketry.com/catalog/motor_detail/em_1608.html

https://blastzone.com/performancehobbies/store.asp?groupid=55

http://www.wildmanrocketry.com/default.asp?groupid=70&groupid1=63&groupid2=51484714

Mark .\\

[Peartree]

I have never seen a Toys R Us in our region that has any kind of rockets at all.

[elbraz]

Hi, Braz,

Could be a glitch, but they did make and distribute a handful of the E9-0's. So, instead of an unfinished E9-4 it might be a mis-labeled E9-0.

I can't recall where, but I know some folks got a few E9-0's. AFAIK, they never made it to the main distributor and retail channels, but, IIRC, some units were sent out as promotional items. (BTW, they did get the booster certified.)

Doug

.
...so, Doug, the question in my mind is do I fly it or not? E9-0's were certified, yes? Or is there a motor collecter market for mis-labels, like mis-struck coins? Personally, I wants to fly it. 7 D12-0 to E9-0 to E9-8, maybe.
-Braz

[Doug Sams]

...so, Doug, the question in my mind is do I fly it or not? E9-0's were certified, yes? It's still on the list: http://www.nar.org/SandT/NARenglist.shtml

Or is there a motor collecter market for mis-labels, like mis-struck coins? Personally, I wants to fly it. 7 D12-0 to E9-0 to E9-8, maybe. -BrazBy the time the 7 D12-0's have burned out, it'll be out of sight, and you'll miss the joy of seeing the E9-0 burn :)

Seriously, I think something along the lines of a BT-55 ought to make a good 2-stager with the E9-0 in the booster. Maybe a bit smaller.

Use another E9 in the sustainer, or maybe a D12 or even a C11-7 if you can scrounge one.

With this 2-stage configuration, you can enjoy the long booster burn.

I know the E9 has a reputation for low thrust, but it's not that low; it's not an E2. If I can build a 3-stager with a B6 in the 1st stage, there's gotta be a way to make an E9-0 work.

Doug

.

[elbraz]

It's still on the list: http://www.nar.org/SandT/NARenglist.shtml

By the time the 7 D12-0's have burned out, it'll be out of sight, and you'll miss the joy of seeing the E9-0 burn :)


Doug

.
Ah, Doug, always the voice of reason. :p Realistically, I would probably go with a really lightweight BT-60 bird to enjoy the flight. Now, if we had production E9's, a seven motor lower stage in a four inch rocket would be smashing. Well vented, you could get reasonable reliability lighting four motors in the upper-stage, maybe... I have to drive to Sayre Ok to fly, so I tend to burn a loot of BP at one time. Glad Boris Katan's doing work on igniters, my stash of Quickburst bp igniters was used up this last weekend.
Wish I had A8-0's for around town. I still have a few A10-0's, but I've never liked them as booster motors, because the long useless thrust tail-off can almost bring a model to a stop before it stages.

-Braz

[STRMan]

I am always wishing for A8-0's. Unlike a B-14, it would be easy to reproduce, as A8's are still being made.

I also wish we still had 1/2A6-4's. I just love staged rockets that don't go out of sight and can be used at small fields.

[Jeff Walther]

I also wish we still had 1/2A6-4's. I just love staged rockets that don't go out of sight and can be used at small fields.

My experience this weekend strengthens my agreement with this philosophy, although in my case, I'd like to see 1/2A3-0T.

My son and I went out for a launch Saturday afternoon. We didn't lose any birds, but the little 13 mm powered rockets were invisible at the top of their trajectories. The smoke trail made them visible again. Still, if we were launching a two stage rocket, I don't know how we'd keep track of it between when the smoke ends and the rocket falls to a visible altitude.

We were flying with 1/2A3-4Ts. On the other hand, my son says he could still see a tiny speck at the top of the trajectory. Ah, for young eyes.

The invisible rockets were break apart recovery though. I suppose there's some advantage to streamer or parachute for successful recovery. On the one hand, the break apart doesn't drift as far. On the other hand, the ones with streamer or parachute are more visible immediately after the smoke trail ends (at ejection).

[Mark II]

My experience this weekend strengthens my agreement with this philosophy, although in my case, I'd like to see 1/2A3-0T.

My son and I went out for a launch Saturday afternoon. We didn't lose any birds, but the little 13 mm powered rockets were invisible at the top of their trajectories. The smoke trail made them visible again. Still, if we were launching a two stage rocket, I don't know how we'd keep track of it between when the smoke ends and the rocket falls to a visible altitude.

We were flying with 1/2A3-4Ts. On the other hand, my son says he could still see a tiny speck at the top of the trajectory. Ah, for young eyes.

The invisible rockets were break apart recovery though. I suppose there's some advantage to streamer or parachute for successful recovery. On the one hand, the break apart doesn't drift as far. On the other hand, the ones with streamer or parachute are more visible immediately after the smoke trail ends (at ejection).
My Midget Mini-Brute clone stays visible on an A3-0T+1/2A3-4T combination. One trick for tracking small rockets: launch when the sun is in the lower part of the sky, such as late in the afternoon/early in the evening, and set up your pad so that the sun is behind you. As the rocket climbs, it will catch the sunlight and be brightly lit against the darker eastern half of the sky. (You could also launch early in the morning too, but at this time of year - for the next couple of weeks, anyway - you would still have to go out pretty early.) Just don't launch so late in the day that the ground is in deep shadow, or you will have a hard time finding your rocket after it comes down. (Launching early in the morning avoids this problem.)

Other ideas to aid in visibility: put some "radar chaff" (glitter) in with your recovery wadding. (I prefer using this instead of tracking powder for sport rockets, because it doesn't stain the paint job.) You could also switch to a metallic Mylar streamer or parachute that will give off reflections while it is aloft. Or you could even attach a few spinner blades (http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/index/index-display.jsp?id=cat190003&navAction=jump&navCount=1&cmCat=&parentType=category&parentId=cat20166) to the bottom of the chute or streamer, or even spaced along your shock cord!

Mark .\\