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-   -   3D printing for EVERYONE (http://www.oldrocketforum.com/showthread.php?t=17185)

scott_mills 03-30-2018 08:07 PM

3D printing for EVERYONE
 
I hope everyone will eventually come to know the Absolute joys of owning a 3d printer. I have only had 1 for 3 days, and have already ran out of filament . It is the best tool in the world for Bar;s that want to clone old hard to find rockets. Thingiverse all by itself provides an awesome selection of model rocket parts, clone parts, and scale models that can be converted to flight. Here are some of the projects that I have already printed parts for downloaded from thingiverse.

1/100 falcon heavy with dragon 2 capsule PARTS
1/152 saturn 5 nose cone, and F1 engines
clone of estes titan 2 engines
1/100 Gemini Nose cone


Boy oh Boy, I need to get some more plastic filament.

UMRS 03-31-2018 07:12 AM

We have 3 of them there fantastic machines.

teflonrocketry1 03-31-2018 07:25 AM

I received my Creality Ender 2 3D printer kit just last week ($175 with 2 day shipping from https://www.3dprintersonlinestore.com/) and plan to clone and design a lot of model rocket parts. I ran out of filament after a few days and am awaiting an order for more. It took me about 1 hour to assemble and align the printer which gives an excellent 3D print for the price; it has a 6" x 6" heated bed with a x 9" height capability.

I have been using PLA filament, as soon as I am able to design and produce high quality parts I plan to switch over to Nylon. I am looking forward to an endless supply of rail buttons, profiled fins and custom nosecones.

For 3D designs I am trying out Autodesk 123D Design and TinkerCAD. As of now I am not very impressed with either of these programs. I want something more technical where I can input actual dimensions and get a good 3D rendering. I am impressed with the Ultimaker Cura 3D printing software that came with the Ender 2 printer, it is easy to use and has produced great 3D prints from the start.

UMRS 03-31-2018 07:44 AM

1 Attachment(s)
We use Cura for all three printers. we have 2 SINDOH DP200's Kevin & Stuart :)

We need to get a photo of BoB, hes a PROMEGA from M3D 12" square platform.

stefanj 03-31-2018 09:30 AM

I'd like to get a 3D printer eventually. I'm not an early adopter. I joke that I'm waiting for one that has input hoppers that accept plastic soda bottles and aluminum cans.

I think a laser cutter will be the first hi-tech shop equipment I splurge on.

scott_mills 03-31-2018 01:07 PM

Creality is great, I got the CR 10. Hey here is a quetion for all you print heads out there, has anyone ever trid printing a wrap? I mean thos rafts around the parts are pretty darn thin and flexible. I will probably try it, when I get my shipment of filament.

teflonrocketry1 03-31-2018 09:21 PM

I have a similar idea instead of decals just print a thin wrap for a body tube, if the print is flexible enough the print might not need to have a curved or profiled surface to it. I think this will work, the problem is how to fasten it down to the body tube. I have been thinking I could print the wrap directly onto a piece of clear tape or clear sticker paper. For scale models, bolt and screw heads could be printed in relief on the wrap.

I saw a video on Maker's Muse https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwqjz5nxOw0 that used spray paint on the filament to change the color of the 3D print. I was wondering if I could use a brush on type paint to get a similar effect and allow me to change colors during the print without having a separate extruder for each color.

olDave 03-31-2018 09:30 PM

On that note (sort of)---
 
What about a good, home-hobbyist-sized laser cutter for making our own custom centering rings?

I know nothing about these machines except (on the websites I have been searching) they seem to be way oversize for my needs, and offer no information about ability to cut cardboard or thin ply. I am looking for something maybe 6x6 inches, although my current need is only for something that could do 4x4 work. Surely there must be something out there that doesn't cost an arm and a leg....

teflonrocketry1 03-31-2018 09:44 PM

Chris Taylor of NARANlive.com has 7 (or more) Creality Ender 2 3D printers and is busy cranking out centering rings, motor retainers and lots of other model rocket parts, visit his YouTube channel at: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCu...90d7Nau1rqa4WqQ

The Ender 2 printers are quiet and don't take up much space, they can easily fit into a 16 inch square space.

scott_mills 03-31-2018 11:03 PM

I can't find the maximum print size other than in pixels, however this is closer to the size of a laser engraver that you wanted, and the price is not too bad. I am still considering one for myself to cut fins and such. You might be able to find it cheaper on Ali Express.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEJE-DK-8-...353.m1438.l2649

DavidQ 04-01-2018 11:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott_mills
I can't find the maximum print size other than in pixels, however this is closer to the size of a laser engraver that you wanted, and the price is not too bad. I am still considering one for myself to cut fins and such. You might be able to find it cheaper on Ali Express.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEJE-DK-8-...353.m1438.l2649

Notice that it's a 1000mW engraver, i.e. a 1W engraver. For laser cutting, you'd want at least a 40W laser. So, that low cost laser is just for engraving, i.e. putting marks on wood, and shouldn't be considered for cutting, even balsa.

scott_mills 04-01-2018 07:42 PM

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Yeah it sure would take alot of passes to get through what you want.

I've done up the cad for a estes titan nose cone,Does anyone with a 3d printer want to try it out ? I can't I do not have any more filament.

teflonrocketry1 04-02-2018 06:42 PM

I got some filament yesterday from Amazon. I can't believe I got a package on Easter Sunday; the USPS label indicates Sunday delivery! I will PM you my details, I would like to try to print the Estes Titan nose cone you rendered.

For cutting fins and centering rings I was also looking at getting a DIY CNC Router Kit like: https://www.amazon.com/Control-Engr...YKAWS86XK2F3PWK

I didn't go this route because I want to cut all three or four fins (or centering rings) out of a stack of wood, all at the same time, so they are all exactly the same size. It is not clear to me if the CNC router like these can handle a 1" thick stack of birch ply. I may purchase a CNC router in the future after some more research. It seems to me that router bits are currently much cheaper than laser tubes, which is why I didn't even consider a laser cutter. Also it seems both of these cutters require a dedicated computer unlike a 3D printer.

tbzep 04-02-2018 09:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by teflonrocketry1
I got some filament yesterday from Amazon. I can't believe I got a package on Easter Sunday

You live in a special place to get Sunday delivery when in very recent history there was discussion of cutting the USPS down to 5 days a week on a national scale. :cool:

olDave 04-02-2018 10:24 PM

I'm gonna keep on looking---
 
I do appreciate the attempt to help, posted by Scott:

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott_mills
I can't find the maximum print size other than in pixels, however this is closer to the size of a laser engraver that you wanted, and the price is not too bad. I am still considering one for myself to cut fins and such. You might be able to find it cheaper on Ali Express.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEJE-DK-8-...353.m1438.l2649


But when I chase this thing down to try to pick up more details, I found some answered questions over on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/Engraver-Res...r+Printer&psc=1
where one of the users says the usable cutting bed is only 2 by 2 1/2 inches.
That's just not gonna do it for me.
But thanks for trying to help.

ghrocketman 04-02-2018 11:24 PM

My understanding is that USPS only delivers Amazon Prime orders on Sunday exclusively due to a special contract with them and FedEx.
"Regular" mail and USPS packages are not delivered on Sundays.

tbzep 04-02-2018 11:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
My understanding is that USPS only delivers Amazon Prime orders on Sunday exclusively due to a special contract with them and FedEx.
"Regular" mail and USPS packages are not delivered on Sundays.

I think that is still only in certain areas. I live in a small enough town to know all of our postal employees and none of them carry parcels on Sunday....yet.

scott_mills 04-02-2018 11:47 PM

To anyone that has a 3d printer and wants to try it out, I enjoyed doing the cad so much that I went ahead and did all of the pieces for the Titan 3e. My bird was missing the decorative tail cone, so the two parts that makes that up were guesstimated rather than measured. You can download the stl files from here.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2845691

I also did the Les offer the Estes Mercury capsule, as a commonly broken replacement piece. That can be found here.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2847499

teflonrocketry1 04-05-2018 08:57 AM

3 Attachment(s)
Scott,

The Titan nosecone looks great, see pictures attached. I had some minor problems with my 3D printer, apparently I need to optimize some more settings. Did you intend there to be facets in the nosecone cap?

ghrocketman 04-05-2018 11:08 AM

I have an original Titan II nosecone.
It does not have facets.
If the intent is to match the Estes cone, it is not correct.

kevinj 04-05-2018 01:45 PM

The facets are there from when the stl file was generated- too low a resolution and you get them.

teflonrocketry1 04-05-2018 02:53 PM

I thought the resolution might be a problem; but this effect is most pronunced on just the Titan nosecone top and not the rest of the part. When I export files from RockSim for 3D printing I always select the high resolution setting, if I don't do this I see simlar faceting but it is on all of the curved surfaces.

scott_mills 04-06-2018 10:13 AM

1 Attachment(s)
No Teflon, those look like they may be artifacts from either your printer or slicer.

I have now completed this things download section, It now contains all the parts necessary to make all 3 rockets, except for the fins which can be found in another thing. I just uploaded my version of the estes gemini titan nose cone to complete the set.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2845691

scott_mills 04-06-2018 10:15 AM

One other thing I have read about 3d printers that may be the cause is when they get taller in the Z axis, there can be more swaying from poorly supported structures.

ghrocketman 04-06-2018 10:52 AM

Decrease the sway limit.

teflonrocketry1 04-06-2018 07:57 PM

2 Attachment(s)
When I got my Ender 2 3D printer the first thing I did was print the 3 modifications that everyone seems to suggest; a 1mm shim for the Z axis motor, a Vrail stabilizer for the Z axis lead screw as well as a duct around the fan to cool both the extruder and parts as they are printed. You can see these last 2 mods in the first picture. Both pictures show an A-20 Demon nose cone I printed before the Titan nosecone. The A-20 nosecone is almost flawless, I used the same slicer settings and spool of filament for the Titan nosecone. Also in the pictures are 2 Centuri PNC-70 style nosecones I printed afterwards using the same slicer settings (but at a higher resolution) and filament, and they are both flawless.

Actually you can see the faceting I observed in the print of the nosecone in the thingiverse image of it. I also had a problem with the nosecap, there seems to be a gap between the bottom plate and the cup or saucer shaped top part, after placing this cap into the bottom of the nosecone the upper part that fits along the nosecone wall easily separated from the bottom half. All the images of the parts you posted to thingiverse show this same faceting.

scott_mills 04-06-2018 10:41 PM

OK i'm going to print it out and see if I can work it out what is going on .

teflonrocketry1 04-07-2018 07:08 AM

Scott,

Does thingiverse limit the file size you can post, which equates to a lower resolution .stl file?

scott_mills 04-07-2018 12:30 PM

I am not aware of any file size limits on thingiverse, I have not done anything to compress the files in any way. Perhaps it is a setting in freecad, I am new to using the software.

On the nosecap, I made a whole new one this morning which starts with a cylinder and trims away pieces until I get the shape that I want. So that the resultant 3d piece is a single piece. The pieces that I have made so far have all been primitives stacked on top of each other at exactly the defining borders between them, After creation I gather them all up and make a union in freecad. So i have printed the new nosecap however I will not post it till I have tried it in a nose cone, which I am currently printing.

I am pretty sure now that the faceting issue that you have noticed has to be an artifact with how freecad handles circular interpolation. Instead of a smooth curve, it converts it to a spline style of object.

scott_mills 04-07-2018 01:36 PM

having printed out the booster nosecone, I have found an error in the 3d design. I have now corrected that, and I will post it to the thingiverse this weekend. I'm going to print it again, and make sure it looks good.

scott_mills 04-07-2018 09:59 PM

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Yay I finally got a successful print, I think it was because I am using a new pla. This stuff requires a higher infill and smaller resolution.

scott_mills 04-07-2018 10:04 PM

If anyone out there is trying to mentally justify the cost of a 3d printer, you can look at it like this, You can now download and print the parts for 3 titan model rockets, that go for $200 or more on ebay.

teflonrocketry1 04-08-2018 08:12 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I think my new 3D printer is well on its way to paying for itself. In the foreground of the picture is what I produced on it this past week. I have yet to separate all the rail buttons from the plastic rafts and supports they are printed on. This week was mainly nosecones, I plan to try transitions and fin cans next. I am even considering purchasing yet another 3D printer.

I like to thank all the other 3D printer owners like Scott who share their CAD files on the internet.

teflonrocketry1 05-10-2018 08:22 PM

Thread Revival:

Did anyone else read the excellent article by Thomas Salverson titled "Custom 3D Printed Rockets" on page 31 in the May/June issue of Sport Rocketry? I think the article nicely explains the process (or workflow) for creating 3D parts. It gives one a good general idea of what you can make with a 3D printer for the model rocketry hobby.

Incidentally you can download the 3D print files for the Estes Orbis kit for free at the Estes Rockets web site: https://www.estesrockets.com/001706...lk-pack-12-pack
The ogive, tapered and rounded nosecones should also be good for a number of BT-20 (18mm) clones , same goes for the 3 fin cans.

teflonrocketry1 05-18-2018 10:27 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I modified my Ender 2 3D printer by increassing the length of the Z axis v-slot rail and Z axis lead screw to 500mm. This was an easy modification that cost less then $35. I didn't have to lengthen any wires or cables as there was ample length provided in the original printer kit. The attached pictures shows a completed 13.5 inch long 2.5 inch diameter conical nosecone I was able to print in one piece on the bed of the printer. I plan to use this noseocne for my Estes Panavia to make it look more like the original Cherokee D. The current configuration on my Panavia to Cherokee D clone is pictured in this thread: http://forums.rocketshoppe.com/showthread.php?t=17244

Since this nosecone came out so nice (this was the first print on the 3D printer after I modified the z axis) I am confident I can print much larger nosecones up to 6 inches in diameter and 15 inches long (counting the shoulder). I have plans to increase the Z axis length on this same printer to 1 meter, however this modification will involve lengthening all the cables and wires for the printer as well as the Z axis structures. The cables are available as a extention kit to a the Creality CR-10 printer (Creality aslo makes the Ender2) for about $20.

DavidQ 05-19-2018 03:44 AM

How thick are you making your nose cone walls?

I like your description of the Ender2 3D, and am starting to consider it for my second printer. Especially if it can easily be extended to almost 20" in height.

I had been using a Printrbot Plus that I put together several years ago, but it doesn't have a metal frame, and the extension I added tends to shade a bit for tall prints, which is bad. It has mainly a laser-cut wooden structure, and it's showing a bit of age.

teflonrocketry1 05-19-2018 12:45 PM

I use three layer thicknesses for my nose cone3D prints; with a 0.4mm extrusion nozzle diameter that translates into 1.2mm wall thickness (about 0.05 inch). I found that 2 thicknesses were not strong enough especially at the shoulder joint of the nosecones. The 3 layer wall thickness is strong enough to resist breakage at the shoulder joint when sanding prior to painting. I am using PLA filament which seems to be very crystalline making it very tough material to sand.

DavidQ 05-19-2018 01:06 PM

I had made my cones with ABS. Before sanding, I cover them with filler primer. Mainly, because I wasn't sure if the proper outside edge of the cone was the outer edge of ridge, the inner edge of the ridge, or somewhere in between. And, it results in less sanding.

scott_mills 06-08-2018 10:49 PM

So now after everyone has read this post and pondered about whether it would be worth it for them to invest in a 3d printer , I hereby offer the best reasons to justify the cost of a printer. First of all I recommend a creality cr10 , it is a great printer out of the box with little assembly required it runs approximately $400. If you find that you are mechanically inclined and want to save money then I recommend the creality ender 3, it runs around $200 . another couple of caveats this is my list of what I think are the absolute best model rocket things to print from thingiverse. I am not partial I do think that several of my own creations are on the list. That said the list.


Estes Saturn V Skylab Model rocket Conversion
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2944705

Nose Cone Fun Pack for Model Rockets
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2876174

Rocket Man
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:369704

Missile Toe v2.0 - flying tree ornament
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2695733

Fin Jig
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1521732

Titan 2 and 3e Parts ESTES
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2845691

Estes Beta Launch Vehicle #2054 Plastic Parts
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1190963

Rock-A-Chute PNC
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:270008

Estes GeoSat LV #1977 Plastic Parts
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:440953

Estes LTV Scout #1287 Plastic Parts
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:496576

Mini Mars Lander
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2869428

Mercury Capsule Launch Escape System LES estes https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2847499

List to be continued

vcp 06-09-2018 03:13 AM

You can just post a single link straight to your collections...

https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr...s/model-rockets
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr...lections/spacex
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr...ions/space-fact
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr.../space-starwars
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr...ions/space-2001
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr.../space-startrek
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacr...s/space-fiction

... so yeah, there's lots of neet stuf to print.


There's also a link to my collection of collections, but that gets pretty messy...
https://www.thingiverse.com/garyacrowellsr/collections
I wish I had time to print half (or 10%) of this stuff.







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