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scott_mills 12-09-2018 02:08 PM

Centuri body tube list
 
Is there a kit by kit list of the body tubes used, and lengths, in a similar way to the published pdf for estes kits?

I have had need lately to look up 3 different centuri kits body tube info with very difficult to zero success . Currently I am trying to ascertain which tubes were used in the ss america 5310

hcmbanjo 12-09-2018 02:20 PM

There is this:
http://www.ninfinger.org/rockets/body_tubes.html
Scroll down to the Centuri information.
To get tube names for the lengths, go to the Semroc page:
http://www.semroc.com/Store/scripts...s.asp?SKU=KV-77
and click on the PDF instruction manual.

Scroll down to the parts view.
If Body Tube "C" is designated as ST-16120, it is a 16 series tube, 12" long.
If the tube were designated as ST-1675, it's another ST-16 series tube, 7.5" long.

That should get you started -
The older Semroc website is a great source for builds.

scott_mills 12-09-2018 03:30 PM

thank you very much

tbzep 12-09-2018 03:35 PM

The classic SEMROC site, Ninfinger, JimZ, and YORF/YORS are the holy grail for classic model rocketry. :cool:

ghrocketman 12-09-2018 03:51 PM

+1 to what tbzep said above.
Holy Grail.

5x7 12-09-2018 03:58 PM

Semroc uss America parts list

The kit is probably a good value also USS America

BARGeezer 12-10-2018 01:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott_mills
Is there a kit by kit list of the body tubes used, and lengths, in a similar way to the published pdf for estes kits?

I have had need lately to look up 3 different centuri kits body tube info with very difficult to zero success . Currently I am trying to ascertain which tubes were used in the ss america 5310


The Semroc USS America is a retro repro, a close reproduction of the original Centuri kit. The Semroc kit uses 24mm motors as opposed to the originals' 18mm motor tube. Unfortunately the links to the Centuri plans for that kit on the JimZ website are not working, but I was able to get the Centuri parts list from an archived page on the JimZ plans site from a few years ago:

https://web.archive.org/web/2010071...ica/cen5310.txt

Love the Wayback Machine! Here's a tip (you might already know, if so, ignore): At the bottom of the JimZ plans if there is a picture of a compass, caliper, and ruler, that is the link to the parts list.

If you are looking for the retro repro, erockets still sells the Semroc kit. If you are looking to CLONE the original Centuri kit, then you can get all the parts from erockets as well. They sell the Centuri ST tubes and even the ramjet cones and nozzles:
http://www.erockets.biz/semroc-plas...ets-sem-pc-5rj/

Sirius also sells the ramjet cones/nozzles, but they are currently out of stock.Would be nice if someone like Mr Brohm could compile a list for Centuri kits similar to the one he compiled for the Estes kits, but that would be another monumental undertaking. As a cloner I'm just thankful for the Estes compilation. Cheers.

Tau Zero 01-08-2019 07:17 PM

Centuri Body Tube List: A Modest Proposal
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott_mills
Is there a kit by kit list of the body tubes used, and lengths, in a similar way to the published pdf for estes kits?

I have had need lately to look up 3 different centuri kits body tube info with very difficult to zero success .
I glanced briefly at John Brohm's excellent Estes Body Tube List.

What do"all y'all" think of something like the attached .PDF file? Please respond. Thanks!

BARGeezer 01-08-2019 09:05 PM

Excellent start! Maybe we can do this as a joint effort, with everybody chipping in a little.

jetlag 01-08-2019 09:16 PM

Yes, that is an excellent start for a comprehensive Centuri parts list.
Allen

Tau Zero 01-08-2019 09:46 PM

Plunging ahead...
 
I'm starting with the Centuri information from the "Classic Kit" listing on the old Semroc page.

I'll need to cross-reference it with JimZ and Ye Olde Rocket Plans, as well. :D

I'll no doubt need help to fill in any knowledge gaps I run into. ;) :D :cool:

Tau Zero 01-10-2019 01:09 AM

Centuri ST-8 tubes galore
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
I'll no doubt need help to fill in any knowledge gaps I run into. ;) :D :cool:

Okay, here's my first call for help. ;) :D

I'm looking for assistance with the following Centuri kits:


1) Arrow 300

a) Are the body tubes ST-8 (dia. is listed as 0.91, so probably)?

b) How long is the main body tube, and are the first two stages 3" long?


2) Excalibur 2

I suspect the first stage is actually a No. 8 Booster Unit KBB-8.

a) Is the booster's outer body tube 3" long?


3) Flutter-By

The Centuri version appears to be ST-8, with an ST-7 motor tube. Can you confirm or deny this?

Thanks in advance for any help you can give. :D

.

BARGeezer 01-10-2019 08:30 AM

1. From JimZ's: http://www.spacemodeling.org/jimz/centuri/cen5037.txt
2. From the Semroc website: http://www.semroc.com/Store/scripts...arts.asp?ID=570
3. From YORP: http://www.oldrocketplans.com/centu...-9/Cen_KA-9.pdf
Header card says .908" dia. That would be an ST-8. And the motor tube would be an ST-7.

Earl 01-10-2019 06:08 PM

I have an unopened Excaliber II and I can confirm that the booster stage bodytube is 3".

I suspect too that the booster stage is the #8 booster kit that Centuri sold as a separate item, but the parts in the bag are all 'loose'; in other words, that 'kit' of parts for the booster does not appear as a 'separate' bag inside the main kit bag.

Earl

Tau Zero 01-10-2019 10:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BARGeezer
3. From YORP: http://www.oldrocketplans.com/centu...-9/Cen_KA-9.pdf
Header card says .908" dia. That would be an ST-8. And the motor tube would be an ST-7.

The "fine print" is at the top of the Flutter-By page:

Outside Body Tube: Centuri ST-8 3.0" long
Inside Body Tube: Centuri ST-7 3.0" long
Nose Cone: PNC-80 2" plus shoulder


BARGeezer, thanks for all three of those links! I appreciate it! :D :cool:

Cheers,

Tau Zero 01-10-2019 10:31 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Earl
I have an unopened Excaliber II and I can confirm that the booster stage bodytube is 3".

I suspect too that the booster stage is the #8 booster kit that Centuri sold as a separate item, but the parts in the bag are all 'loose'; in other words, that 'kit' of parts for the booster does not appear as a 'separate' bag inside the main kit bag.
Earl,

After looking closer at the #8 booster instructions, is there an HTC-7B connector (the one that goes *outside* the ST-7 tube) in your Excalibur II, as opposed to an HTC-8, as well?

Please advise. Thanks! :D
.

Earl 01-10-2019 11:42 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Earl,

After looking closer at the #8 booster instructions, is there an HTC-7B connector (the one that goes *outside* the ST-7 tube) in your Excalibur II, as opposed to an HTC-8, as well?

Please advise. Thanks! :D
.


Jay -

Interesting: there does NOT appear to be an HTC-7B in the kit bag. I looked 'inside' the larger #8 tube, the #7 to #8 plastic connector, etc. just to make sure it wasn't hiding somewhere. Again, this is a sealed kit, but I think if that Passport staging connector was in the bag, it would be visible.

The #8 tubing connector to otherwise connect the two stages together WAS in the bag.

Earl

Tau Zero 01-10-2019 11:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Earl
this is a sealed kit, but I think if that Passport staging connector was in the bag, it would be visible.

The #8 tubing connector to otherwise connect the two stages together WAS in the bag.
Earl,

Okay, thanks! I'll add that to this body tube list. :D

Cheers,
.

Tau Zero 01-24-2019 08:57 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
I'll no doubt need help to fill in any knowledge gaps I run into. ;) :D :cool:
Today I'm looking for body tube lengths for the Centuri "Argus" 5039 / KB-9.

I remembered I had the attached PSR-78 reducer and body tube included in a multiple nose cone purchase from Mike Hellmund way back in 2001.

The ST-7 body tube is 6.0” long.

I had this one "back in the day," so I know that the two other tubes are ST-8 and ST-13, but I'm not sure exactly how long they were.


Looking at the attached .PNG file, I estimate the ST-8 at 5.0", and the ST-13 at 10.0". HOWEVER, I need somebody to confirm/deny my suspicions.

Thanks in advance! :D

Tau Zero 01-25-2019 11:32 PM

Rough draft released - 25 Jan 2019
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
I'm starting with the Centuri information from the "Classic Kit" listing on the old Semroc page.

I'll need to cross-reference it with JimZ and Ye Olde Rocket Plans, as well. :D
Here's my first rough draft, which I hope will be helpful until I can make more progress on this project.

67 Centuri rockets so far, if I counted correctly.


Any feedback or pertinent comments are welcome.

Thanks!

hcmbanjo 01-26-2019 08:35 AM

Great work Jay! Your work will help us all.

I always like the Centuri body tube sizing by diameter and length,
Not just random letters like with the Estes parts.

Ltvscout 01-26-2019 04:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Here's my first rough draft, which I hope will be helpful until I can make more progress on this project.

67 Centuri rockets so far, if I counted correctly.


Any feedback or pertinent comments are welcome.

Thanks!

Jay,

When you have a "final" version or are close to it make a new post in the Plans forum and post it there. I'll then make it a sticky.

LeeR 01-26-2019 05:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Today I'm looking for body tube lengths for the Centuri "Argus" 5039 / KB-9.


Jay,

Sandman has an Argus kit for sale. Maybe he could measure the tubes, provided they can be easily measured in the bag?

Unless you are wanting the kit, in which case for $80 you get the kit, and the measurements! ;)

Tau Zero 01-28-2019 12:13 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeR
Jay,

Sandman has an Argus kit for sale. Maybe he could measure the tubes, provided they can be easily measured in the bag?

Unless you are wanting the kit, in which case for $80 you get the kit, and the measurements! ;)
Lee,

Thanks for the heads up. Unfortunately, I'm short on cash due to looming hospital bills (wife had her gall bladder removed). :eek: ;) :)

Also, this message below is all I get. (There is no joy in Mudville...)

Tau Zero 01-28-2019 12:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ltvscout
When you have a "final" version or are close to it make a new post in the Plans forum and post it there. I'll then make it a sticky.
LTV "Scott" ;) ,

Will do! :D :cool:
.

BEC 01-28-2019 12:42 AM

Jay,

Sandman's site is only up for ordering during the day when he can "manage" the inventory manually.

Also...you can add the Viking, catalog #5440 (one kit) or #5441 (box of 12 kits) with the same parts as the Akela-1 to the body tube list.


....and, best of luck to you and your wife with respect to the gall bladder surgery. My wife went through the same thing a couple of years ago. It was "interesting" for a few days. Don't be afraid to stay ahead of the pain.

LeeR 01-28-2019 12:08 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Lee,

Thanks for the heads up. Unfortunately, I'm short on cash due to looming hospital bills (wife had her gall bladder removed). :eek: ;) :)

Also, this message below is all I get. (There is no joy in Mudville...)


Sorry Jay! Hope your wife is doing well.

I find it’s best for me to only try to visit Gord’s site at night. I’ve saved a lot lately ... ;)

Tau Zero 01-28-2019 04:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeR
Sandman has an Argus kit for sale. Maybe he could measure the tubes, provided they can be easily measured in the bag?
Lee,

I sent Gord a PM, and he was kind enough to take measurements for me. ;) :D :cool:

Tau Zero 01-28-2019 04:25 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcmbanjo
Great work Jay! Your work will help us all.

I always like the Centuri body tube sizing by diameter and length,
Not just random letters like with the Estes parts.
Thanks, Chris! I appreciate the vote of confidence. :D

Back in the day, I remember discussing body tube "names" with an Estes fan.

The best they could come up with was, "You can put three BT-20s in a BT-60, and have a three-motor cluster. See? It *does* make sense!"


--I *still* wasn't convinced.

However, it depends on how you were conditioned. ;) :D

Tau Zero 01-28-2019 04:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BEC
....and, best of luck to you and your wife with respect to the gall bladder surgery. My wife went through the same thing a couple of years ago. It was "interesting" for a few days. Don't be afraid to stay ahead of the pain.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeR
Sorry Jay! Hope your wife is doing well.

Yep, it's been a couple of months, so she's doing *much* better.


Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeR
I find it’s best for me to only try to visit Gord’s site at night. I’ve saved a lot lately ... ;)
:D
.

BEC 01-29-2019 12:05 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Thanks, Chris! I appreciate the vote of confidence. :D

Back in the day, I remember discussing body tube "names" with an Estes fan.

The best they could come up with was, "You can put three BT-20s in a BT-60, and have a three-motor cluster. See? It *does* make sense!"


--I *still* wasn't convinced.

However, it depends on how you were conditioned. ;) :D


Bill Simon has said he wished that he'd done that tube size naming some other way (he claims responsibility). And yes, that's exactly how BT-60 got to be BT-60. If you look at the oldest Estes catalogs you'll see the first place it was used is the Ranger and Cobra - both three motor cluster models.

Tau Zero 01-30-2019 04:54 PM

It seemed like a good idea at the time...
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Back in the day, I remember discussing body tube "names" with an Estes fan.

The best they could come up with was, "You can put three BT-20s in a BT-60, and have a three-motor cluster. See? It *does* make sense!"


--I *still* wasn't convinced.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BEC
Bill Simon has said he wished that he'd done that tube size naming some other way (he claims responsibility). And yes, that's exactly how BT-60 got to be BT-60. If you look at the oldest Estes catalogs you'll see the first place it was used is the Ranger and Cobra - both three motor cluster models.
Bernard,

After wrestling with the (very rough) attached section, I wish Bill had done it some other way, too.

"If the tube ends in '-J,' that means it's 2.75" long? Say WHAT?" :eek:

"And why do the big letters have little (i.e., shorter) tubes?" :rolleyes:
.

mwtoelle 01-30-2019 10:13 PM

I'm not sure but I think that some of the Estes tube length length codes just sort of "happened". If you think that the J designation for a 2.75" tube was interesting. What about the BT-5T and BT-20AE? Both tubes are 1.5" long. There were some tubes that had some pattern to their length code (i.e. BT-5BJ (2.0"), BT-20DJ (4.0"), BT-63CJ (3.0"), BT-50EE (5.5")), and then there were some that had codes specific to a particular kit (i.e. 1298 X-Wing Fighter used an XW length code, but the LL-1, BT-3, BT-5, and BT-20 tubes were all different lengths).

Tau Zero 01-30-2019 10:13 PM

Centuri Thunderroc 5340
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hcmbanjo
Great work Jay! Your work will help us all.
Can anyone please identify the nose cone used in this kit?

Centuri Thunderroc 5340 / ST-16180 (3) / 1.640” O.D. / 1.600” I.D. (1980 - 1983)

Thanks yet again!

BEC 01-30-2019 10:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Bernard,

After wrestling with the (very rough) attached section, I wish Bill had done it some other way, too.

"If the tube ends in '-J,' that means it's 2.75" long? Say WHAT?" :eek:

"And why do the big letters have little (i.e., shorter) tubes?" :rolleyes:
.


I don’t think Bill will take the blame for the letter suffixes. I always just assumed that this happened the same way the nose cone letters seem to have happened....pretty much when a new size (or shape) was needed they just incremented the letter by one.

Although if that were strictly true I’d expect the body of the K-1 Scout to be BT-30A and the nose cone to be BNC-30A. For the body tube that turns out to be right, but the nose cone is BNC-30D. Oh well.... :rolleyes:

BARGeezer 01-30-2019 11:03 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tau Zero
Can anyone please identify the nose cone used in this kit?

Centuri Thunderroc 5340 / ST-16180 (3) / 1.640” O.D. / 1.600” I.D. (1980 - 1983)

Thanks yet again!


Per the Centuri plans at JimZ's, it is catalog #71043. Searching the Semroc "Classic Cross Reference" pages, that catalog # is a PNC-60AH. Interestingly, catalog #s 71013 and 71014 also show as PNC-60AH. So I would take it with a grain of salt.
http://www.semroc.com/Store/scripts/xref.asp

Tau Zero 01-31-2019 05:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BEC
I don’t think Bill will take the blame for the letter suffixes. I always just assumed that this happened the same way the nose cone letters seem to have happened....pretty much when a new size (or shape) was needed they just incremented the letter by one.

Although if that were strictly true I’d expect the body of the K-1 Scout to be BT-30A and the nose cone to be BNC-30A. For the body tube that turns out to be right, but the nose cone is BNC-30D. Oh well.... :rolleyes:
(chuckling) It seems to be pretty arbitrary. At least enough to make my head spin. :eek:

It also seems like it could be one of those things that get set up initially, and then whoever picks up the process has to muddle through it.

Whether the muddling is successful, though... :rolleyes:


It's additional proof that "your mileage may vary."
.

tbzep 02-01-2019 07:18 AM

Back in the 50's and 60's money was pretty tight, especially for hobbies. The Estes/Centuri folks probably never had a clue how big the company would grow, much less realize how many dozens of nose cones and tubes they would eventually carry. I imagine when they came up with designations, they figured they wouldn't need something extremely organized for just a few variations.

Tau Zero 02-26-2019 11:01 AM

UPDATE: 26 Feb 2019
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ltvscout
When you have a "final" version or are close to it make a new post in the Plans forum and post it there. I'll then make it a sticky.
Scott,

Here's what I've got for now. It's not entirely complete, but it's been languishing on my hard drive for a month now without any updates.

(I was laid off [again] recently, so the whole job search scenario has been occupying my time.)


Please note the few "red letter" entries, for which I still need solid information.

Submit any questions/corrections/etc. on this thread. Thanks! :D


Cheers,

scott_mills 02-26-2019 10:45 PM

Awesome work, everyone.


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