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  #1  
Old 03-31-2016, 05:21 PM
Ulisesbeato Ulisesbeato is offline
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Default Saturn V question on various issues...

Hi there folks,

A question about the different scale versions of the Saturn V.

In my research I see that there are these various versions of the model such as...

Estes: Saturn V: K-36 or #1236
Estes: Saturn V: #2001
Estes: Saturn V: #2157
Estes: Semi-Scale Saturn V: K-39 or #1239

Centuri: Saturn 5: KS-12 or #5142

Apogee: Saturn V: #05026
Cox: Apollo Saturn V: #5075
Dr Zooch: Saturn V:
Neubauer: Micro Saturn V

Can someone please give me a rundown on which versions offer what and what's is most desirable within this array of kits?

For me, nothing beats the historical scale stuff and the Sat V is such a beaty.

Looking forward to hearing from you

Cheers, all!
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  #2  
Old 03-31-2016, 06:41 PM
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ghrocketman ghrocketman is offline
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As far as Estes/Centuri versions go, general concensus is that the Centuri kit is the best of the bunch other than the latest Estes kit. the latest Estes kit is a virtual clone of the Centuri kit right down to the plastic wraps. The only difference is the last version of the Centuri kit came with a 3x18mm Cluster mount and an interchangeable single 24mm mount like the old Estes K-36/1236.
The Estes K-36/1236 and 2001 are virtually identical other than the 2001 separates at the first transition for recovery like the Centuri kit, whereas the K-36/1236 separates at the capsule which is horrible. Often a single 24mm motor toes not have the 'oomph' to pressurize that long/large tube and eject two 24" and a 12" chute.
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  #3  
Old 03-31-2016, 06:43 PM
Rob Campbell Rob Campbell is offline
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Saturn V 1236 and K-36 were the same. In 1974, Estes renumbered all their kits from a K-xx to a 12xx (TKxx to 08xx for Mini-Brutes). This was apparently to accommodate computer inventory systems.

Estes kit 2001 was a reissue of the K-36/1236. I don't know of anything was changed.
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  #4  
Old 03-31-2016, 06:50 PM
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hcmbanjo hcmbanjo is offline
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You should also add the FlisKits MMX Saturn V.
This MMX version uses a cone at the rear for stability.

Sirus Rocketry also makes a Saturn V kit.

BMS also produced the Peter Alway Saturn V kit.
A detailed and well engineered model.

Sheri's Hot Rockets also produced a Saturn V. Green Arrow Hobbies owns the rights now.

The original Estes versions had embossed cardstock wraps. By the time these were glued on some of the embossed detail was lost.
The Centuri version had the more detailed vacuform wraps. The Centuri kit also had two piece vacuform fins and fairings.
The most recent Estes Saturn V used all those vacuform parts.
Estes is re-issuing the Saturn V, this time with molded plastic fins, a big improvement.
The engine mount will be upgraded for larger engines.

The Apogee Saturn V is probably one of the more accurate, it's 1/70 scale.

The Estes semi-scale Saturn V wasn't much with the clear fins. Look up the instructions and you'll see why.

I've only seen a Cox Saturn V. I was surprised one the pre-painted roll patterns was off. It seemed very chunky.

The Dr. Zooch version is BT-60 based, the same size as the older semi-scale Estes.
This version is detailed and flys with the four outside nozzle bells in place.

I've built a lot of these. For me, the best are:
Smallest - Fliskits MMX Saturn
Medium size - Dr. Zooch Saturn V
Largest - the upcoming Estes Saturn V with molded fins.

Personal favorite is the Dr. Zooch kit.
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Last edited by hcmbanjo : 04-05-2016 at 09:33 AM.
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  #5  
Old 03-31-2016, 08:15 PM
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LeeR LeeR is offline
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The re-release of the 2157 Saturn V from Estes could cause me to get one, even though I have 3! The most recent Saturn 1B and V models have vacuformed fins, and are a pain, and certainly fragile. There were discussions about the new Saturn V having molded plastic fins (maybe two-piece, like the new Little Joe II).

After just building a 1B with 8 vacuformed fins, I'd definitely love to see molded fins for the V. In fact, there were lots of requests for a "fin kit upgrade" for older models, when word got around about the change (or potential change -- I do not recall if it was a promise, or a "strong consideration".

I'd hold off and look at the new Saturn V kit when more details become available, if you want a 1:100 scale kit. If bigger is a consideration, then by all means, look at the Apogee and Sirius Saturn V kits. both are really nice.
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  #6  
Old 03-31-2016, 09:09 PM
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Rocket Babe Rocket Babe is offline
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Once you settle on which one you want you might want to consider purchasing 4-5 so you can cluster one, stage one, etc.

Verna
www.vernarockets.com
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HHJHOK6
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O14ET8K
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  #7  
Old 04-05-2016, 09:00 AM
Ulisesbeato Ulisesbeato is offline
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Talking Saturn V (K-36) The direction I'm going

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocket Babe
Once you settle on which one you want you might want to consider purchasing 4-5 so you can cluster one, stage one, etc.

Verna
www.vernarockets.com
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HHJHOK6
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O14ET8K



Thanks Rocket Babe and everyone for all the great insight. It seems this rocket is not just the grand-pappy of all rockets in real life but in the modeling world as well. From the Dr. Zooch version all the way through the Steve Eves world record, it's all quite a subject and a heck of a build in each case.

I can definitely see having more than one of these for various reasons. As head of the Cuban Space program here in Brooklyn though, I do have some budget constraints.

For now this is what I have. The Estes 1236 (K-36) Sat V kit. I must say, after having even successfully built (and flown) the Estes Space shuttle with the separating orbiter back when it was available, AND countless other rockets and models since the early 70s, I find this to be a quite difficult build to do it right .

I've been reading up on the build on Chris Michielssen's blog (great blog, thanks Chris)

Folks, here's where I'm at...

I want to build and fly this bird as it was intended, with a 3 engine (C6-3) configuration. However, I'm wondering if I should try to convert this one to the body configuration of the 2157 which separates the body into 2 (at the third stage section) upon ejection rather than just popping the plastic capsule off. It seems like this particular advancement in this model's design has been favored since the K-36

I'm thinking in this direction because it seems more reliable and I think if I can get the upper stage (in the case of the 2157 style design) to land on the ground on it's side it would save the escape tower from damage rather than it landing tower first and smashing it. with a cluster config, I'm not so much worried about ejection problems.

Would any of you with experience be able to shed any wisdom on this subject?

Thanks in advance for your time and expertise.
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  #8  
Old 04-05-2016, 09:41 AM
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hcmbanjo hcmbanjo is offline
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Check out the older Centuri instructions:

http://oldrocketplans.com/centuri/cenKS-12/cenKS-12.pdf
Page 8 of the old Centuri instructions show how to tie up a line so the upper section falls with the tower up.

Personally, I wouldn't risk launching a 3 engine cluster on such a detailed build, especially with the "Starter" igniters.
But, that's up to you!
Estes is recommending the E30-4 engine for the upcoming Saturn V release.
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www.oddlrockets.com
www.modelrocketbuilding.blogspot.com
http://www.nar.org/educational-reso...ing-techniques/
Your results may vary
"Nose cones roll, be careful with that."
Every spaceman needs a ray gun.
Look out - I'm the Meister Shyster!
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  #9  
Old 04-05-2016, 07:26 PM
Ulisesbeato Ulisesbeato is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hcmbanjo

Personally, I wouldn't risk launching a 3 engine cluster on such a detailed build, especially with the "Starter" igniters.


Thanks for your feedback, hcmbanjo

First please clarify what you mean by "starter" igniters"

second, what exactly are your reservations about clustering? I was under the impression that it would be the best method to use in order to get enough power on the lift off and the ejection to ensure proper deployment of the shoots.

If anyone else would like to chime in please do. It would be much appreciated.

Cheers, everyone!

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  #10  
Old 04-05-2016, 07:50 PM
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ghrocketman ghrocketman is offline
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Estes 'starter' igniters are basically the old Solar Igniters without the pyro dip.
This is due to some new garbage regs.
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When in doubt, WHACK the GAS and DITCH the brake !!!

Yes, there is such a thing as NORMAL
, if you have to ask what is "NORMAL" , you probably aren't !

Failure may not be an OPTION, but it is ALWAYS a POSSIBILITY.
ALL systems are GO for MAYHEM, CHAOS, and HAVOC !
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