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  #11  
Old 05-19-2020, 09:14 AM
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Earl Earl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Those two B6-4s in that "Wind Rider" rocket had WAY short delays.
Looked more like B6-2s at longest.
I do not understand the concept of using 2 clustered B6's in ANYTHING.
A 3 engine cluster I understand. It gives one more than a full C but less than a full D.
It makes far more sense to use a single Estes C6-5, C11-5, C5-3, or Quest C12-4.

Unless one is making a scale Gemini Titan, two engine clusters make zero sense at all to me.
They just add complexity where none is needed. Just use the proper impulse sized single engine.


Let's face it: cluster black powder *anything* is not really needed these days and hasn't been for years. BUT, people still fly them for fun...and what they want to do for fun (within legal bounds, or 'rocketry' legal bounds, lets say) is up to THEM.

As for composites, well, to me, those REALLY don't start until you get up to 38mm, and in some ways, I'd stretch that to say they don't really, really get interesting until you get up to 54mm and beyond (say, J class and higher). I mean, if you are going to go high power lets really pour the coal on.

But, fun and challenge is in the eye of the beholder. Live and let live.

Earl
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  #12  
Old 05-19-2020, 03:30 PM
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Does anyone know the filament and fiber optics sizes needed for the full size 3D cineroc camera project?
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  #13  
Old 05-19-2020, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rosko_racer
I was given a 3D printed mini Cineroc payload section and I installed an 808 1080p Keychain camera in it. Loaded it up on top of a scratch build 2-clustered Deuce rocket I named "Wind Rider"... Great flight and great video. I actually build two versions of the Wind Rider to carry the Mini Cineroc pod. The Mini Cineroc 808 files can be found here on Thingiverse. I uploaded a video of the first flight on YouTube here . There is a Cineroc Tribute Facebook page that shows the development of the 3D printed version and also some great videos have been posted.

I never had an original Cineroc but with today's technology and the help of some good friends (Jim Filler, Scott Branche, and Kevin Johnson) I was able to enjoy this.

- Raul

Cool flight video Raul. I like the dual smoke trails from the canted motors!
I built a LOC Weasel-29 with a Aiptek PenCam and I had decent results at the time but the 808 1080p cameras like you used is sooooo much better

https://www.oldrocketforum.com/showthread.php?t=2222

I see in my old thread I got the idea from tbzep from his StormCaster rocket that carried the same camera I used in my Weasel-29. I still have parts from that rocket somewhere .....
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  #14  
Old 05-19-2020, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
I do not understand the concept of using 2 clustered B6's in ANYTHING.

Plenty of good reasons:
1. Making it more complicated just for the sake of making it more complicated.
2. Twin cluster just for fun.
3. Practice for novices before stepping up to triple clusters.
4. Having a crap ton of C6-5's to burn from a Walmart clearance so you build a twin cluster. (me)
5. Using B6-4's in your C6-5 cluster burner for smaller field demos. (me)
6. Scale models.
7. Clones of twins such as the Centuri Power System. (me)
8. Because we can.

Forgot a big one. With twin motors, you can get a similar thrust profile to your vaunted B14 with two A8's, or close to the D8 with a pair of B6's.
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Last edited by tbzep : 05-20-2020 at 12:01 AM.
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  #15  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:43 AM
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ghrocketman ghrocketman is offline
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I stand corrected, tbzep.
You make several valid points.
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  #16  
Old 05-20-2020, 03:02 PM
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Back in the 70's, one of my carrier vehicles of choice was a two stage, two engine cluster. BT60 body tube, steamed and 'squashed' on one end to fit two BT50 engine mount tubes, and what used to call "CHeap And Dirty" (CHAD) staging where you simply tape the boosters to the bottom of the sustainer engines.
It made for very interesting Cineroc videos (especially when one of the booster engines CATO'd - which happened more than once - fortunately they'd lite the sustainer when they let go), got good altitude, and it was cheaper than an Enerjet or an F100 (and interestingly more reliable than the F100s which had a nasty habit of not firing the ejection charge).
I'm thinking about recreating that booster for a modern day 'Cineroc' project.
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  #17  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:05 PM
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ghrocketman ghrocketman is offline
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I never had trouble with F100's not firing their ejection charge if they did not cato during the thrust phase. Plenty of catos during the propellant burn, but nowhere near as bad as the cato rate of the E60. I have no idea why those stupid E60s were not de-certed within 6mos of their first existence. Only motor I'm aware of that had an over 50% cato rate.
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When in doubt, WHACK the GAS and DITCH the brake !!!
No DIRECT and MEASURABLE Harm=NO Foul advocate

If you are NOT FLYING LOW in the left lane, you need to GET THE #$&@ OUT of it !

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, if you have to ask, you probably aren't
!
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  #18  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:30 PM
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tdracer tdracer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
I never had trouble with F100's not firing their ejection charge if they did not cato during the thrust phase. Plenty of catos during the propellant burn, but nowhere near as bad as the cato rate of the E60. I have no idea why those stupid E60s were not de-certed within 6mos of their first existence. Only motor I'm aware of that had an over 50% cato rate.

I used to fly the Cineroc from my front yard - I lived on the very east end of town (our back windows literally looked out on the prairie - we could see the local airport ~6 miles away) so with the wind out of the west (which was the norm) I could easily recover out in the prairie. Views of the neighborhood were far more interesting than when I launched it in the prairie...
I flew 3 F100 motors (two lofting a Cineroc), and one failed to fire the ejection charge (dust bin recovery of the Cineroc when it impacted on asphalt ). Granted, 3 motors is not a good statistical sample, but it was enough to convince me not to bother with that motor.
In contrast, I flew my two stage/two D cluster Cineroc carrier over a dozen times with just one unsuccessful recovery when one engine failed to ignite. It went up about 50 ft. and did a loop, then staged when it was roughly parallel to the ground, headed west . It flew over one house, then crashed into the next house. It took out a few potted plants but there was no damage to the brick house. Cineroc and booster were pretty much destroyed, but the film cartridge was intact - the video was ASSUME !
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  #19  
Old 05-21-2020, 01:56 PM
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luke strawwalker luke strawwalker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdracer
the video was ASSUME !


AWESOME perhaps?? Darn autocorrect strikes again??? LOL OL J R
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  #20  
Old 05-21-2020, 04:24 PM
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tdracer tdracer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luke strawwalker
AWESOME perhaps?? Darn autocorrect strikes again??? LOL OL J R

Yea, AWESOME. I do need to look closer when it corrects my spelling
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