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  #11  
Old 06-30-2021, 12:57 PM
NOLA_BAR NOLA_BAR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afadeev
Upscale LJI or LJII would be a fairly straight forward model to scratch build. Except for the funky conical nose cone/Capsule.

Does anyone have a lead on large (6+") conical nose cones?
I had checked the usual suspects (PML, LOC, WM, MC, Apogee), and stubby conical nose cones are just not in vogue for large diameter / HP applications.


You would use the LOC 5.38” tubing for the Boyce Abort Capsule. I corresponded with Alex a couple times, but it just did not go anywhere.
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  #12  
Old 06-30-2021, 02:28 PM
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Ez2cDave Ez2cDave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afadeev
Upscale LJI or LJII would be a fairly straight forward model to scratch build. Except for the funky conical nose cone/Capsule.

Does anyone have a lead on large (6+") conical nose cones?
I had checked the usual suspects (PML, LOC, WM, MC, Apogee), and stubby conical nose cones are just not in vogue for large diameter / HP applications.


This should help you make your own . . .

https://www.rocketryforum.com/threads/12-foam-nc.162415

Dave F.
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  #13  
Old 06-30-2021, 02:58 PM
ronhender ronhender is offline
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ghrocketman, I believe he said used a cluster of g motors (and not all of them fired) around a Ceseroni K711.
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  #14  
Old 06-30-2021, 03:07 PM
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Sounds about right power wise, but a single large L or small M would have reduced complexity.
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  #15  
Old 06-30-2021, 04:43 PM
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georgegassaway georgegassaway is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afadeev
Upscale LJI or LJII would be a fairly straight forward model to scratch build. Except for the funky conical nose cone/Capsule.

Does anyone have a lead on large (6+") conical nose cones?
I had checked the usual suspects (PML, LOC, WM, MC, Apogee), and stubby conical nose cones are just not in vogue for large diameter / HP applications.


For my 1/22 scale, 7" diameter Little Joe-II, the "capsule" was mostly built like a paper shroud, using sheet plastic. For the "hard BPC, part that the tower is mounted to, I used a 4" diamter vac-formed plastic cone from my 1/39.5 scale models, trimmed to a smaller diameter to be scale. I designed/built the whole thing so that the hard BPC poriton with the tower, plugged inside of the top of the shrud-like 7" "capsule". That was a practical thing for assembly, and also a very practical thing for transport of the model, because the entire LES tower/motor assembly was all in one piece.

Anyway...... consider the paper shroud type method...with something stronger like plastic, and use something like a 4" or smaller wood cone for the hard BPC portion, trimmed from the base-up to match the correct diameter. And, actually, it becomes in the realm of practicality to make your own 3" or so BPC cone by turning it yourself on a drill. Although I should say, check with Roachwerks first.

http://georgesrockets.com/GRP/Scale...IFs/BPC-LES.gif
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  #16  
Old 06-30-2021, 04:47 PM
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Ez2cDave Ez2cDave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Regardless, one should be able to do it wherever they pleez, without ANY sort of HP License.Should have access to through "P" sized motors without any sort of cert either.


Hmm . . . 1st rocket ever Estes Alpha on an A8-3 . . . 2nd rocket ever, a "P" motor . . . Oh, HELL NO ! ! !

Dave F.
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  #17  
Old 06-30-2021, 04:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Sounds about right power wise, but a single large L or small M would have reduced complexity.


A single motor would obviously reduce complexity, but the original was a cluster of seven motors. To some people, it's not a proper scale unless it's also the original number of engines.
Most of my Saturn V flyers are single motors "to reduce complexity", but I have played around with a few five motor clusters. Unfortunately they have not always gone well.
The worst was an Estes Saturn V - center F10 around four C6. I was worried that the F10 might not light and only it fire the ejection charge, so I added electronic ejection. Well, sure enough, I flew it and got all four C6's but not the center F10 - it went up maybe 200 ft., the electronic ejection fired and ejected the chutes, all is well, right? Well, not quite. Apparently the electronic ejection lit the F10 from the wrong end . It smoked for a few seconds, then the bottom burst into flames still about 50 ft. off the ground.
The entire lower portion was a write-off...
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  #18  
Old 06-30-2021, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Regardless, one should be able to do it wherever they pleez, without ANY sort of HP License.
Should have access to through "P" sized motors without any sort of cert either.


TRA and NAR have done a good job of managing the high power cert process - and kept it reasonably safe and successful in the process.

Abandon that, and I flat guarantee that the government would step in with a far more complex and expensive licensing system that wouldn't work nearly as well.

I have no issues with going through the L1, L2, and L3 cert processes - and given what I can do with an L3 (and what could potentially go wrong), you need to have someone managing it. Otherwise you're going to have Darwin Candidates flying L3 rockets - a couple of those going wrong would destroy high power rocketry.
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  #19  
Old 06-30-2021, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by georgegassaway
Anyway...... consider the paper shroud type method...with something stronger like plastic, and use something like a 4" or smaller wood cone for the hard BPC portion, trimmed from the base-up to match the correct diameter.


George,

"Back in the day", I would have suggested using 1/64" - 1/32" plywood "skins". Unfortunately, good luck finding a local Hobby Shop, especially one that stocks thin Aircraft Plywood.

John Coker used an interesting method to construct a conical Nike-Tomahawk Interstage . . . This could easily be adapted to construct an Apollo Command Module ( pics below ).

Dave F.
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  #20  
Old 06-30-2021, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ez2cDave
George,

"Back in the day", I would have suggested using 1/64" - 1/32" plywood "skins". Unfortunately, good luck finding a local Hobby Shop, especially one that stocks thin Aircraft Plywood.

Dave F.


We lost our good local hobby shop about two years ago (still have Hobby Lobby and HobbyTown although I agree with your assessment).

However AC Supply sells both 1/64" and 1/32" plywood.
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